Stingy this!
: Sitting in the MSNBC newsroom, I saw a bulletin come across saying that the U.S. government had just pledged $350 million. This is turning into a worldwide Israel Bonds dinner: a competition to top this! And that is a wonderful thing.
59 responses to “Stingy this!”
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Yes, it is great — but we shouldn’t have to have been pushed to do it.
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Eh. Maybe we shouldn’t have to have been pushed, but I sure am glad it’s happening.
Happy New Year everybody. We may argue, but when it comes down to it, we’re all in this together. -
Who says we did it because we were pushed?
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People donating freely = wonderful generosity
Government “donating” tax dollars = forced “charity”
Come on guys — it’s not the government’s money; it’s ours. When you donate other people’s money it’s not charity. Please stop confusing the government with the people. -
In addition to the many fine relief orgs already mentioned, you can give to the American Jewish World Service here:
https://secure3.ctsg.com/AJWS/donation/ -
Name one person who object to the government using would there tax money to aide people suffering from the tsunami.
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This is 1,25 dollar per person in the US. Denmark is at approx. 10$ per person. There is still a fair way to go.
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It certainly looks like Michael Hartl objects, (see his post above).
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“Yes, it is great — but we shouldn’t have to have been pushed to do it.”
No, we shouldn’t have, so: Sorry for waiting until the tsunami hit, everybody. -
Soon I expect to see a NYTimes editorial denouncing the spending of $350 mil and saying said sum should be applied to help the poor here, save Social Security, find a cure for AIDS, etc., etc.
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Yes, it is great — but we shouldn’t have to have been pushed to do it.
Hey, he’s right! And as Oliver pointed out on his blog today, aren’t there aother causes we should be thinking about?
Today’s the last day you can make a tax deductible donation to Media Matters for America for 2004, assisting in the fight against conservative misinformation in the media.
Keep your priorities straight, folks! Donate to Media Matters because the last I heard they depend on only the lil’ people for funding!
NOTE: As Oliver pointed out, you can avoid paying taxes by doing this! Forget about the tsunami, dig deep and support Media Matters…today! -
Well, except that I already wrote about the tsunami and I’m not the President of the united states.
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It seemed to me that you were pushed to write about it.
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Q: So, is there anything righty bloggers won’t start a pissing contest over?
A: Nope. -
Just the righty ones. Righty.
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Uh, Jeff Jarvis voted for Kerry.
Q: Is there anything some folks (liberal or conservative) won’t take time to stop by and piss on?
A: Nope. -
Of the many things that Jesus had a point about but, let’s face it, was kinda wrong about, let’s put that whole “widow’s mite” thing at the top of the list.
Yes, yes. It was great that she threw her two mites into the plate but she helped fewer people than the “hypocrites” who threw in bags of gold.
Yeah, the widow was virtuous but only people who have missed the point entirely think that it’s about virtue.
It’s about helping the other people.
The US “only” gave a buck per person while Denmark gave ten bucks per person. That’s impressive until you look at how many people each country has.
The hypocrites feed more hungry children with their bags than the widows do with their two mites.
The thing in Asia now is *NOT* about how virtuous one feels but on how many virtuous acts one does (or, through money, allows to be done). It’s about the outcome. -
Of course, Dubya needs a lot of help. Even after the South Asian disasters of last week, he still thinks tsunamis are something you ask your attorney to do with Vietnamese immigrants seeking refugee status in America. Ho, ho, ha! A shot of oafish humor across the bow. Dubya wouldn’t find amusement in it and neither would Dick Cheney, unless you had a wad of cash that you wanted to donate to the re-election petty cash fund. Both would give you that tough-guy, droopy-eyed stare while watching you drop the check on an aide, and wish you good luck at finding the polls on Election Day.
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The hypocrites feed more hungry children with their bags than the widows do with their two mites.
Are the “hypocrites” given at least a few weeks to ramp up to their promised billions? Forgive me, I’m probably being naive when I believe Powell’s statement that our aid will end up in the billions.
These first few days have all been about gestures and appearances, unfortunately. This is a long-term disaster. I don’t give a shit whether the U.S. looks the best for PR purposes in these first few days, but I do care that we do the right thing over the long haul.
If the U.S. hasn’t done its part two months from now, perhaps this will be a valid criticism. Until then, maybe we should STFU and all do what we can, regardless of political stripe. -
The only sad thing we can take from this is that the devestation is even worse then we can imagine.
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Oliver Willis, do you now feel that President Bush cares about public opinion, American and Worldwide, since you assert he has been “pushed” to $350 million?
If Bush doesn’t care about public opinion, do you have another explanation – one that perhaps uses Occam’s razor – for the increase? -
I don’t want a surtax, thanks.
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I have to admit that I am usually sceptical of the motives behind what the US does, but on this particular issue, whatever the motive or whatever the cause of this pledge is, there is no doubt that this money will be a great help to the victims of the Tsunami. And for that, I am greatful and appreciative to the US.
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I too am happy. However, the charity of muslims does not apply to non muslim victims of the disaster. This is what a leading muslamist,Dr.
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maintaining an aircraft carrier task force costs about 4M a day, a marine battle group costs at least half as much. both were sent to indian ocean – that’s 11.000 men & women send on open-end mission to help victims.
within a month ( and it might last longer) that’s 200M plus. not a direct cash outlay on US part, but not a negligible sum
do we need to attach a glow-in the dark/ fluorescent $$$ tag to everything we do? -
Kat, when you look in a mirror do you puke? Since you support “The Barnabas Fund”, a fund that only gives aid to Christians? Or is the correct for Christians to only give to their own, but not for Muslims?
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Dries, one could point out that you would still have to pay maintence for the ships even if you didn’t move them to the Indian Ocean, so I’m guessing the cost won’t be the 200M you talk about. Not that I’m not thankful for all the help that the suffering people get.
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A few years ago, there was a water contamination disaster in a small Canadian town called Walkerton. At that time, help poured from around the world.
This time, a day after the tragedy in South Asia, the mayor of Walkerton, called on his city council members for an emergency meeting in which they decided to donate money (don’t know how much) to help the victims of the Tsunami.
When asked why, the mayor referred to the help his town received from the currently effected people, including their Muslim population, when his own town was in need of help. So, it doesn’t matter who says what, it is the action of people that counts.
He has called on other municipalities, to do the same and donate to the victims. -
PK–when I give in my church for disaster relief, the priest never eartags it Christians only–we are collecting for all victims of this disaster. The Barnabas Fund is a personal charity I support, like the Boy Scouts or the Heart Foundation or the Cancer Society. I know someone who works with the Barnabas Group and that is how I got involved. Right now I am supporting some ministry building houses in Mexico because they were my neighbors and asked for a donation. I didn’t say no because I don’t belong to their church. I said yes because it is a good cause.
A priest would never say muslims can only have our aid if they convert. The Pope is calling for the world to help these victims, regardless of religion. This disaster is no place to be preaching what that Moustapha guy is preaching. It’s no way to win hearts and minds of infidels. -
PK – a very good point, but both groups were due to return home after deployment in the gulf. i’m sure it’d have been considerably cheaper to have “lincoln” docked in SF, that to keep it in bay of bengal.
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Kat, it’s not that hard to find leading christians that believes that you shouldn’t donate to non-christians. There are nutjobs in every religion.
I don’t judge Christianity based on The Westboro Baptist Church thanking God for the Tsunami killing 2000 Swedes, and I won’t judge Islam on what one guy says. -
They are not Christians if they believe they shouldn’t help everyone. If a Christian leader advised such on a site, all hell would break loose. All the victims are equally important.
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Saw you today on MSNBC. You did a great job and came across as very well-spoken and knowledgeable about blogs and the internet. Well done.
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Kat, so the people running “The Barnabas Fund” aren’t Christians then? Are they only acting as Christians to solicit donations from real Christians? Maybe you should stop donating to them.
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“As for non-Muslims, they might deserve donation or any other form of assistance but not Zakah.”
He doesn’t say that they aren’t allowed to donate to non-muslims, what he says is that you can’t give them Zakah (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakah).
You can still give ordinary charity, sadaqah, even to non-muslims. -
“Name one person who object to the government using would there tax money to aide people suffering from the tsunami.”
Me. Why would anyone want their tax money going to tsunami relief? You were already free to donate anything you wanted to such efforts. No, using public funds is all about the cheap greace inherent in contributing *other people’s money*.
“Yes, it is great — but we shouldn’t have to have been pushed to do it.”
You can’t get tax revenues to spend without pushing. -
Somewhat OT
Check out an anlysis on media bias here:
http://www.jeffperspective.blogspot.com/ -
“Name one person who object to the government using would there tax money to aide people suffering from the tsunami.”
The Ayn Rand Institute:
“Year after year, for decades, the government has forced American taxpayers to provide foreign aid to every type of natural or man-made disaster on the face of the earth: from the Marshall Plan to reconstruct a war-ravaged Europe to the $15 billion recently promised to fight AIDS in Africa to the countless amounts spent to help the victims of earthquakes, fires and floods–from South America to Asia.”
Note: I do not agree with the Institute. -
The writer of the article in Nick’s link is David Holcberg, a Zionist who I am sure doesn’t oppose giving out billions of dollars of the same US tax payers’ money every year to Israel as so-called aid.
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Faramin,
It’s always those damn JOOOOS, right?
I wish you and yours a new year filled with nothing but misery and pain.
Afshin -
According to the latest figures (470,000+ estimated) the tragedy is becoming the greatest tropical disaster in recent times.
The response from the world community is overwhelming and I believe that each (including governments) who contributed will look back and be assured and proud that they did the right thing by responding quickly.
May God bless all. -
Japan has just raised aid to $500 million.
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Here’s a way to demand that U.S. aid reach $1 billion immediately–We’ve posted a petition here . Please sign it and pass it on. Thanks.
President George W. Bush
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
Washington, D.C. 20500
Dear Mr. President:
We are in the midst of a human catastrophe. Tens of thousands have died in South and Southeast Asia in the worst natural disaster in recent recorded history. Millions more now face death from untreated injuries, starvation, dehydration, exposure and disease. And once the threat of death passes, these communities face months, if not years, of rebuilding their lives in shattered villages, towns and cities.
We cannot stand by and let this happen.
We are the richest country in the world. We have the largest economy. We have the most powerful military.
Yet, to date, our response to the disaster has been inadequate. Wth all due respect, Mr. President, the money you have committed to the relief effort does not come close to what our country can afford-and more importantly, what the moral values of our country demand that we give.
This is not a Republican or Democratic issue. This is about decency, compassion, and the humanity that binds us all-no matter what party we support, what faith we practice or what race we belong to. What we do now will speak loudly about our moral values. Our efforts can show us as the caring people we are, and do much to restore our standing in the world.
Therefore, we the undersigned ask that you immediately commit the U.S. to a $1 billion contribution to the people of South and Southeast Asia, to be allocated without delay. In addition, we ask that you direct the United States military and other appropriate U.S. agencies to offer logistical support for relief efforts until the immediate crisis passes. And we also ask that when Congress reconvenes, it immediately consider legislation authorizing further long-term aid and assistance to ameliorate the pain and suffering still to come, as millions of people struggle to recover and rebuild.
When history judges us as a nation, it will not measure how many wars we won or how rich we grew. We will be judged on whether, at a time when our fellow humans desperately needed us, we used our wealth and privilege to help them. -
…and Oliver thought $350 million was “great!” What a Scrooge! Same goes for JT. Whay would I sign some petition asking for a measly billion? It’s like a frickin’ Dr. Evil impersonators’ contest over here! Only a billion? I’m not going to sign anything asking for less than a gazillion dollars. Pikers.
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I wonder if we can get the net into this competition. Remind various publishers that this is a medium/long term committment. Start building lists of legitimate relief groups, their capacities (eg. geography) and needs. Shift funds (requests for donations) at different stages of intervention.
Analyze performance…
Right now I’m pushing International Medical Corp because they are medium sized which I think offers more flexibility than the big players and because they were already established in Indonesia.
http://www.imcworldwide.org/wherewework.shtml -
Unbelievable, JT your letter to the President is pathetic. People are turning this tragedy into a political pissing contest about who can give more aid. Granted the outcome is for the overall good of those affected by the tragedy, but I am sure that would have happened anyway without all this carping.
While you try and claim impartiality in your little letter, it is hard to not see the backhanded slap you are trying to give the President. I would rather you shut up and donate your own money and time to those in need as others continue to do. Just look at the total at Amazon.com, it is amazing what people can do in times of need. We don’t need the likes of you to lecture us and the President about charity. -
I second afshin’s sentiment about Faraschmuck.
And may Fat Oliver soon realize a life of eating pie and beating off to Beyonce photos is pathetic. -
I think US presence in that area, actually helping people, is far more important than throwing a billion dollars at a useless body like the UN. The US will spend far more than a billion. It is much easier to just donate a sum and not be in the area using your country’s resources to help. While everyone wondered how to get to Banda Aceh, the US figured a way to get food and medical to those people. A billion dollars is a waste if in the hands of Koffi and his crooks. They need US equipment and technology far more than money. This is not about politics–at least it shouldn’t be.
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Afshin and Taji,
“First”ing or “seconding” the iditic comments with yet another idiotic comments, doesn’t make you sound intelligent.
Can’t you just say something without insult that carries some value in it? Or is this the only way you’ve ever learned? -
You forgot to call them “zionists”, Faramin.
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Why can’t those who say they want to give aid be satisfied with giving their own money?
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And Faramin, can you not say anything that is not insulting to Jews–just because you call them zionists does not excuse your anti-semitism. I know that is how you were schooled but can’t you leave your stinking hatred in the shithole you came from. In USA and Canada we like and respect Jews. We recognize Israel as a state and we don’t want Israel muslimfied.
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Kat,
It is interestring that Afshin and Taji are supported by you. That’s enough to show were they stand.
It doesn’t matter how you interpret my comment, and quite frankly I don’t care how you see it. I have never insulted Jews and I will never do as there is no ground for that. Unlike you who constantly insults Muslims. I am not a Muslim and I am not A jew, but I am grown up enough to realize problems with religions (that I myself have), doesn’t give one any excuse to insult the followers of those religions. I wish you could reach that stage too, but you have shown that in simple tasks, you can easily fail again and again.
A Jew is not necessarily a Zionist, and a Zionist is not necessarliy a Jew. For example, you are not a Jew, but chances are that you ARE a Zionist.
Instead of BSing about the term that I’ve used, why don’t you discuss what I’ve said that the guy; David Holcberg, who opposes using American peoples’ tax money for the relief by saying that money is not government’s money to spear, will not oppose using the same money to give billions of dollars of aid to Israel every year? -
Oh btw Kat,
Please don’t dilute the name of Canada with dirt by attaching yourself to it. -
Faramin and Kat et al:
I’m going to say this one more time: Please take this elsewhere. It’s boring and I suspect it’s below each of you. I see nothing added to any civil discussion. You have established quite firmly that you can’t stand each other. Stipulated. Now move on, please. -
You ‘diluted’ the name Canada when you became a refugee there.
I’m really disgusted at the muslim countries’ response to this disaster, aren’t you? Yet they can find billions to fund terrorism and build terrorist mosques and install fanatic leaders in them. -
Jeff,
I know you love to blaim me on these issues. But just look at the comments that prompted me to reply. The same comments that kept you silent.
I don’t initiate insulting comments and you know that, but when I am insulted many times by many people, you remain silent and as soon as I reply, you start blaiming me.
I have expressed what I think about Holcberg and what he thinks about assisting the victims of the disaster, but no one has attempted to address that issue but they have been quick to insult me only for the sake of insuting me.
People can ignore one’s comment, but when they decide to address the comment, at least the answer should address the main issue mentioned in the comment as well AND THAT IS WHAT CIVIL DISCUSSION MEANS. -
Awww wittle Faraschmuck’s feelings are hurt. Tsk, tsk. Just tell yourself it is always the Joooos that are wrong and you’ll feel better – Loser.
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It may be that the U.S. will end up spending more than a billion, as one of our compatriots here writes. But, we’re trying to get the government there through citizen input.
http://www.americamustdobetter.com
Pass it on.
