Kerry’s God problem

Kerry’s God problem

: David Brooks says today that John Kerry has a God problem — but, remarkably, Brooks deals with only one side of the problem and completely ignores the other.

Brooks says that Bill Clinton (who mentions his doubts about religion as a young man at the start of his autobiography) “understands the role religion actually plays in modern politics. He knows Americans want to be able to see their leaders’ faith.”

And Clinton seems to understand, as many Democrats do not, that a politician’s faith isn’t just about litmus test issues like abortion or gay marriage. Many people just want to know that their leader, like them, is in the fellowship of believers. Their president doesn’t have to be a saint, but he does have to be a pilgrim. He does have to be engaged, as they are, in a personal voyage toward God….

John Kerry doesn’t seem to get this. Many of the people running the Democratic Party don’t get it either.

A recent Time magazine survey revealed that only 7 percent of Americans feel that Kerry is a man of strong religious faith. That’s a catastrophic number…. They should be doing everything they can to change that perception, because unless more people get a sense of Kerry’s faith, they will feel no bond with him and they will be loath to trust him with their vote.

Yet his campaign does nothing. Kerry talks about jobs one week and the minimum wage the next, going about his wonky way, each day as secular as the last.

I don’t disagree with any of that. We are not quite so religious a nation as Europeans like to think, but we do want to know where candidates stand on God — not too strong, not too weak, just right.

But Brooks completely ignores Kerry’s specific problem with religion: He’s Catholic, man. He’s pro-choice. He’s stuck between the rock upon whom Jesus built his church and a hard place. If he turns all religious and Catholic, liberal and women voters will fear he’ll go soft on choice. If he stands up to the church on abortion and gay rights, among other issues — as he well should, if he could — he will unleash a Vatican fatwa against him, for Catholic bishops already have proven they’ll mix church and state and try to get Catholics to vote against Catholics who don’t parrot what they say. Brooks says none of this. Does he have no editors?

22 responses to “Kerry’s God problem”

  1. MrAcheson Avatar
    MrAcheson

    Do you really think Bill Clinton is a good example of a politician that maintained consistency between his faith and rhetoric? Not only was he very socially liberal (unusual for a Southern Baptist) he was also an admitted and repeated adulterer. Not an argument that really works with me, but I never voted for Clinton so maybe I’m not in the right demographic.

  2. Mike Avatar

    Correct me if I’m wrong, but there is no edict in the Catholic faith suggesting a separation of church and state. Quite the contrary, I would hope that a man or woman so devoted to their faith would be equally devoted to maintaining the beliefs of all those who claim to be faithful, government officials not excluded. If the government made it standard procedure to write laws based on church doctrine than that would be wrong, but church’s shouldn’t feel pressured to not speak out against individuals with whom they disagree.

  3. Ed Avatar

    Do you have to use the word “fatwa?” Bin Laden used a fatwa to order 3,000 innocent Americans to their death.
    You might despise the Catholic Church, but it doesn’t issue orders demanding people be killed.

  4. Kathy K Avatar

    A fatwa is a religious edict. They can be for anything from what length a man should wear their hair to death orders.
    I’m glad the Catholic Church did quit issuing orders to put people to death. But keep in mind that it’s a fairly recent development in the lifetime of the Church.

  5. Ed Avatar

    Kathy, the word “fatwa” in this day and age is very loaded language and obviously meant to evoke an image. I just can’t believe it was used in this instance without the writer trying to make a specific impression.
    What is this world coming to when terrorists who behead innocents are referred to as “insurgents,” but Catholic leaders who may or may not react to what a Presidential candidate does are projected to issue a “religious edict” of any kind?

  6. Angelos Avatar
    Angelos

    Churches can lobby for GWB all they want. They can pay taxes too. That’ll solve a lot of local budget deficits.
    People have been menu Catholics for years. No one with a mind of his/her own is 100% by the book.
    Politicians have to run the country for the populace, not for the pope. I don’t care what GWB or JFK do in their spare time, on Sunday morning, whenever. That’s their business. I’ll keep to mine.
    But keep that bullsh*t out of my laws, out of my bedroom, and stay damned far away from a woman’s right to control her reproductive system.

  7. Andy Avatar

    Brooks is not about to bring up the old saw about “Catholics taking orders from the Pope” that was tagged on JFK. That would only encourage the JFK association Kerry has been trying to make for the past couple of years.
    Kerry’s faith like his position on most everything seems very facile and convenient. He will be whatever you wish him to be. He will appear to be whatever you need from a leader. He will not be a man of core characteristics and strong beliefs altho he will appear so.
    It’s impossible to be all things to all people and a man of conviction at the same time. To Be is To Be Limited. When a person is defined they ARE these and ARE NOT those things.

  8. arminius Avatar

    Isn’t the whole “parrot what they say” thing kind of a critical component of the Catholic Church? To what degree can one call oneself Catholic and publicly champion positions against very major components of Catholic doctrine?
    Nobody is forcing the guy to be Catholic. He chooses to be so. If I were to join a Society For Those Who Wear Straw Hats and steadfastly and publicly refuse to wear hats, much less straw ones, might the Society have some reason to question the sincerity of my membership? Would raising the question at all be somehow out of bounds?
    If the guy wants to believe things other than what the Catholic Church believes, then maybe he is something other than a Catholic–and maybe the Church’s leadership might have some stake in pointing that out. And maybe people who call themselves Catholic and actually DO believe what the Catholic Church believes deserve a little more credit than just being catagorized as a bunch of “parrots.”

  9. Charlie (Colorado) Avatar
    Charlie (Colorado)

    “You might despise the Catholic Church, but it doesn’t issue orders demanding people be killed.”
    Recently.
    I’ve been a Buddhist for almost 40 years, so I really don’t have a particular dog in the fight, but just intellectually it would seem that as strongly as the Catholic Church takes the issue of abortion, how can they not insist that professing Catholics vote against a pro-choice candidate?

  10. Ed Avatar

    The Church doesn’t endorse candidates. It hasn’t ex-communicated pro-choice politicians like Mario Cuomo or Rudy Giuliani. It has clear teachings on abortion. It has clear teachings on other topics, such as how to treat the poor.
    Two opposing candidates in an election could each support and oppose various aspects of Church teaching. In that case, most Catholics would just pick the candidate they think would do the most good.
    This article by Joe Califano spells it out in more detail.

  11. Dimmy Karras Avatar

    The Brooks piece isn’t so much about policy as about religiosity in general. Most American voters want candidates who tell us that they pray frequently. Kerry can say things like that without engaging the church in a debate over abortion and gay rights.

  12. Rob M Avatar

    The point of the article is about “belief in God” not about adherence to one church or the other.
    Kerry is a member of the Catholic Church. Not the point, I want to know about his belief in God. Does he talk to God every day? Every week? Twice a month? Ever? What is the roll of prayer in his life? Does he use prayer to help make tough choices or decisions? Does he trust in God?
    The question is about faith and it is far more important than the teachings of any one church.

  13. dauber Avatar

    I’m sorry, Jeff, I read your stuff every day, and b/c I do I can say that you of all people should now how offensive “fatwa” is in this context and in this day and age. The Church has no rt to tell people how to vote — but it does have the right to determine who may receive Communion. That is hardly a Vatican hit job.

  14. Angelos Avatar
    Angelos

    I am truly scared of anyone who would make planet-altering decisions based on “conversations with god.”
    Should he wear a tinfoil cap too, like the people on the streetcorner we call “crazy?” Mumble to himself?
    Pure insanity.

  15. Angelos Avatar
    Angelos

    I am truly scared of anyone who would make planet-altering decisions based on “conversations with god.”
    Should he wear a tinfoil cap too, like the people on the streetcorner we call “crazy?” Mumble to himself?
    Pure insanity.

  16. Andrea Harris Avatar

    Post twice?
    Nice slam against religious people, Angelos. You’ve just called the majority of humanity purely insane. You must be terrified to go out of your home.

  17. Jim B Avatar

    I find it incredibly disingenuous of people who complain about political activism by the Catholic church yet have remained silent *forever* about the same thing that goes on the pulpits of other churches.
    I recall vividly how Clinton (and every other national Democratic candidate) has gone to black congregations and have even taken to the pulpits themselves. I’ve watched those same preachers who host those candidates campaign actively for said Democratic candidates. Sometimes they hide under supposedly non-partisan “Get Out the Vote” operations, sometimes they rail against Republicans openly from the pulpit.
    …Yet to this day there is no outrage over “separation of church and state” and all the other bunk that I hear when Catholics decide that one of their core beliefs – the sanctity of life – is worth fighting for…
    Partisan double-standards, anti-Catholic bigotry or just so blinded by the abortion issue that the hypocrisy goes unnoticed?
    Perhaps a little of each…perhaps one to the exclusion of others…for each person who ignores the obvious it may be different…
    No matter what the purported excuse…the end result is ridiculous…
    There is no point to belonging to a group with a set of beliefs unless that group is willing to make a stand on those beliefs. As an earlier commenter noted, if you stand against those beliefs other members of the group have a right to point it out – even if that person regards himself as above the rules that apply to other people…
    Bottom line: This isn’t a separation of church and state issue. If it was, the Democratic Party and the congregations which support them would have run afoul of it a long time ago and people would have screamed bloody murder…This is something else entirely…

  18. Angelos Avatar
    Angelos

    Post twice – blame a balky computer day.
    As far as prayer goes, i’ll semi-retract, as I was very harried today by computer/work issues, and wrote off-the cuff.
    If you or Tom or Dick or Mary pray at your respective bedsides for guidance in one matter or another, fine, it doesn’t affect me.
    If either of these f**cknuts vying for leadership of the greatest country in the world pray for guidance, instead of looking at actualy non-fairytale-based FACTS, that’s insane, and yes, Andrea, scary.
    I don’t care if they’re deciding on war or farming subsidies or education bills.
    Keep your gods off of my country. Religion kills, in one way or another.

  19. Sydney Carton Avatar
    Sydney Carton

    “If either of these f**cknuts vying for leadership of the greatest country in the world pray for guidance, instead of looking at actualy non-fairytale-based FACTS, that’s insane, and yes, Andrea, scary.”
    I hope you never read any histories of the Constitutional Convention, where Benjamin Franklin daily led the members in prayer for a successful endeavor. In fact, you’d pretty much have to call insane most if not all of the Presidents of America, including the greatest among them – Washington, Lincoln, Roosevelt, Reagan, Madison, Adams, Polk…. the list goes on and on.

  20. cj Avatar

    I think one of the issues that is touched on but not adequately addressed in this post, but is represented in this comment:
    “I would hope that a man or woman so devoted to their faith would be equally devoted to maintaining the beliefs…”
    I think you can, in the view of most Americans, substitute “so devoted” (above) with “claim to be.”
    The one thing about claiming to be a member of a religious faith, is that you are saying you agree with those beliefs. To wit, that you are proclaiming a standard, and others can judge you as to your CONSISTENCY.
    I think Americans value “consistency” very highly. They may disagree with Bush’s “born again” philosophy — but they will judge him on whether his actions are consistent with his avowed stance. I.e., it helps one to identify hypocrites.
    I think that is why Kerry is getting some flak on his claim to be Catholic. Catholics are calling him on it when he doesn’t adhere to the tenets of that religious sect.
    It’s why people critize Jim Baker (sp?) for claiming to be a religious man, while his actions prove him to be otherwise.

  21. Andrea Harris Avatar

    “Keep your gods off my country.”
    So are they real or not? And it’s not just your country, you know. I can see what sort of country you’d like to live in: one where people are afraid to worship in public lest the police drag them off to jail.

  22. Angelos Avatar
    Angelos

    Freedom FROM religion is as important as freedom OF religion.
    I’m not trying to stop you and like-minded individuals from gathering on Saturdays or Sundays together to thank your daily bread or whatever it is you do.
    I myself, on Sunday morning, am either worshipping a small dimpled sphere and praying it find its way into a hole, or I’m defending a large metal rectangle, praying I don’t let any black-and-white spherical objects past me.
    That’s what makes America great.
    The problem comes when “religious” people get on their high horses and try to enforce their beliefs on everyone else because it’s god’s will or some shit like that. Or people who have obviously given up any concept of critical or independent thought, and try to enforce something on a whole population because it’s in the bible.
    IT’S A BOOK! A WORK OF FICTION! Written by men, to control women. Simple.
    The best part is, you all have different fairy tales, and you somehow all think you’re following the “right” one, and that everyone else should too.
    Doesn’t that strike you as odd? Doesn’t that strike you as, um, STUPID?
    So yes, keep your gods off my country.
    Andrea, how small-minded must you be to write “And it’s not just your country, you know…”? Don’t have a real point to make, parse some words the way you want to see them, followed by a BS rhetorical accusation.
    And Sydney, you probably don’t realize it, but in trying to negate my point, you help make it.
    Read this again: “…where Benjamin Franklin daily led the members in prayer for a successful endeavor.”
    They prayed for “success.” THEN, they actually had to do real work. Argue, hammer out agreements, do the right thing for the WHOLE COUNTRY. Which takes intelligence and impartial knowledge.
    You can pray on Sunday for your sales pitch on Monday to work so you can win the big account. But why are you going to win the account? Because you’ve been working your ass off for 3 months, because you know your product inside and out, and because you convinced the buyer that you’re the right person for the job.
    Prayer and god have nothing to do with anything in the real world, and should NEVER be used to determine what is best for everybody.