The real liar quits

The real liar quits
: Andrew Gilligan — the Jayson Blair of Britain, the man who brought the BBC down to shame — has, at last, quit.

But he goes out shameless. He’s the one who sexed up the story. But even after an amazingly extensive investigation that found that he was the sexer upper, Gilligan still accuses the Blair government of sexing up its report and he has the audacity to use that phrase again:

If Lord Hutton had fairly considered the evidence he heard, he would have concluded that most of my story was right. The Government did sex up the dossier, transforming possibilities and probabilities into certainties, removing vital caveats; the 45-minute claim was the ‘classic example’ of this; and many in the intelligence services, including the leading expert in WMD, were unhappy about it….

This report casts a chill over all journalism, not just the BBC’s. It seeks to hold reporters, with all the difficulties they face, to a standard that it does not appear to demand of, for instance, Government dossiers….

No, you haughty, clueless, disastrously destructive, unrepentent, and incompetent lunkead, you cast a chill over all journalism. For you singlehandedly diluted the credibility of our craft. You brought the BBC to shame.

Good riddance!

I’ll take a Coke with my fish ‘n’ chips, please…

: A commenter bets he’ll have a book deal by Wednesday.

I’m betting a juicy job on The Independent.

: Now this is funny: Russia’s minister of media criticizes the BBC for apologizing. Why, in our day at Pravda….

: Thanks to the comments, I’m watching BBC’s Newsnight show now and the acting head of the BBC, Mark Byford, is being pushed hard by the interviewer to accept the Hutton report. What he keeps saying is that “the BBC accepts that Lord Hutton has published his report.” How Orwellian. The BBC acknowledges that the sun came up. The BBC acknowledges that Hutton published. The BBC acknowledges, he says, that Hutton criticized the BBC. He says he apologizes “for our errors.” He won’t admit and apologize for sexing up the report. Round and round it goes. Until the BBC accepts responsibility for what it has done — and it has not — repair cannot begin and damage will continue.

74 responses to “The real liar quits”

  1. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >For you singlehandedly diluted the credibility of our craft. You brought the BBC to shame.
    Only in “right wing blown all out of proportion” land.
    I noticed you didn’t include this telling bit, or maybe just didn’t read that far.
    “The report has imposed on the BBC a punishment far out of proportion to its or my mistakes, which were honest ones. It is hard to believe now that this all stems from two flawed sentences in one unscripted early-morning interview, never repeated, when I said that the Government “probably knew” that the 45-minute figure was wrong.”

  2. scott orrell Avatar
    scott orrell

    Robert-
    What punishment has the Government IMPOSED on the BBC? Didn’t the Hutton Report simply state facts and opine on the state of the BBC’s editorial processes? Where is the punishment? The tragedy here is the putzes are allowed to resign instead of forcing them to defend themselves.

  3. Steve in Houston Avatar
    Steve in Houston

    You know, maybe if the BBC wasn’t a government organization, it wouldn’t be so beholden to government “pressure”. It’s hard to see them as the victims of a government whitewash when it has created a massive industry based on direct taxation of the citizenry.
    The Beeb has at some point decided that “independent of” the government should actually be “hostile to” it. I suppose in some circles that passes for good journalism.

  4. Joe Maller Avatar

    He’ll have a book deal inked by Wednesday. Disgrace just doesn’t seem to mean much anymore.

  5. tom Avatar

    “…he would have concluded that most of my story was right.”
    Most of it was right – good enough for government work.

  6. button Avatar

    Well, I don’t know if you’re in the mood for it, Jeff, but their Newsnight program is coming up at 5:30 PM EST. And the notes on the website say it’s going to be all about the BBC Turmoil. You can watch it on your computer over the Internet if you really want to. I’ve got a limited tolerance for TV and I don’t think I could sit through the whole thing.
    The Beeb is going through some kind of psycho-paroxym over there. Like all roads link back to this emotional trauma. They’re almost having a nervous breakdown or something like that. Not a pretty picture.
    And Jeremy Paxman is often (?) the host of that show which is their version of Nightline– but he’s no Ted Koppel! I’ll bet Paxman is going to be brutal. Maybe even metaphorical blood on the carpet. Oooh– I don’t want to look.

  7. Doctor Slack Avatar
    Doctor Slack

    The Spectator responds to the weirdness of Hutton. Frankly, on the face of them, some of Hutton’s conclusions should be, and are, seriously raising eyebrows.

  8. Richard Cook Avatar
    Richard Cook

    I believe the term “Lying Sack of Shit” is appropriate for Mr. Gilligan.

  9. IceCold Avatar

    If the BBC had backed off the two flawed sentences in the never-repeated interview, as should have been a more or less normal course of action once it was clear there were sourcing issues, none of this would have transpired. Isn’t that correct? The Hutton inquiry was mostly sparked by the Kelly suicide, not by the subtstance of the dispute over 45 minutes. The competence and attitude issues revealed (or confirmed) by the process of wrangling over the erroneous report are the real meat here.
    As for Gilligan, his “reporting” from Baghdad as it fell to US forces in April stands as a fitting capstone to his BBC career, and shouldn’t be clouded by the whole Kelly/Hutton business, which pales in comparison. Al-Jazeera must have room with someone displaying Gilligan’s intellectual heft and moral sensibilities, I should think.

  10. Harry Avatar

    Have you ever listened to Gilligan’s report Jeff?

  11. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    I’ve read the transcript, Harry. And don’t try to tell me that it sounded different in the hall than it did on the air. (Dean joke; see above.) I’ve also read transcripts of his “reporting” in Baghdad. And I’ve seen Dyke’s smarmy contempt for American media even as he refused to clean up his own shop. I’ve certainly seen all that and I am saddened and appalled at what this threesome did to bring down what I once thought was the best news organization in the world. They hurt the credibility of the BBC and all journalists. And the we-want-Greg protests and demonstrations of cluelessness on the behalf of BBC staff won’t help. All the crap about how some hate Blair more is irrelevant. Gilligan slimed journalism. Yes, I’ve read it.

  12. John Avatar

    Just read that Spectator article Doctor Slack linked to. Jeez, the Tories were really counting on the Hutton report bringing down Blair, huh? How else to explain the lapses in logic and reasoning that pervade the entire piece?

  13. Doctor Slack Avatar
    Doctor Slack

    How else to explain the lapses in logic and reasoning that pervade the entire piece?
    Such as…

  14. Kelli Avatar

    Of course, the irony of all this is that a professional writer (who seeks to persuade of his own arguments, thereby picking and choosing from admidst the possible data, then shaping it to fit the needs of the moment) sought to DELIGITIMIZE government officials for doing precisely the same thing.
    No one in government, journalism, academia, business, etc. says, “here is all the data pertaining to this topic, pro and con–you sort it out, I have no opinion either way.” Anyone doing so would be fired. Life consists of making decisions and justifying them ever after. Gilligan comes off as a juvenile trouble maker (whose antics cost a man his life and nearly toppled a government). That the Beeb stood up for him to the very end speaks to a culture of enablers and liars. Very sad.

  15. Steve in Houston Avatar
    Steve in Houston

    Exactly, Kelli. It reminds me, naturally, of how the New York Times put its reputation on backing Jayson Blair, until such time they could no longer tolerate his presence.
    It’s good to be loyal, but the fact that the organizations throw so much massive weight behind these kind of charlatans indicates to me that there is a LOT of self-regard and denial in these stands. The presumption seems to be “But we’re the NYT/BBC – there’s no way we would have these problems because our reputations prevent it.”
    I especially like the Belmont Club’s treatment of this mess.

  16. CaliGirl Avatar

    It used to be when you were forced to resign in ignomity and discrace you actually felt ignominy and discrace. You left with your tail between your legs, jumped off a building, plunged a ritual knife into your abdomen, apologized, that sort of thing. Nowadays, when someone does something shameful s/he rationalizes it and blames someone else. Truly all sense of honor seems to be missing in this ‘modern’ era.
    I mean how would YOU feel if something you wrote in spite and with bile was responsible for the suicide of a man? I would live in guilt for the rest of my life. Sheesh.

  17. Drake Avatar

    : A commenter bets he’ll have a book deal by Wednesday.
    I’m betting a juicy job on The Independent.

    I’m betting the Spectator.

  18. PJF Avatar

    Yes, Robert McClelland, it is a shame that Jeff didn’t include that very telling bit. It shows us all that Gilligan is still telling lies, even today.
    When he says:
    “…when I said that the Government “probably knew” that the 45-minute figure was wrong.”
    he isn’t ‘quite’ owning up to the gravity of what he did.
    What he claimed on that infamous, on-air, official state broadcast chat with John Humphries, was:
    “what we’ve been told by one of the senior officials in charge of drawing up that dossier was that, actually the government probably erm, knew that that forty five minute figure was wrong, even before it decided to put it in.”
    [copied direct from Hutton website]
    Nobody really cares that deeply what Gilligan himself says – but if it’s a government official supposedly saying it, they bloody well take notice! That’s serious, government falling stuff if true – or serious, career ending stuff for the government official who supposedly said it, if untrue.
    All Gilligan and/or the BBC had to do was issue a prompt withdrawal and correction. Instead, the BBC, all the way up to the Chairman of the Board of Governors, just blithely stuck with it – without even bothering to check to see if there was any basis to it.
    We can see that for people in ‘left-wing make-it-up-as-you-believe land’ (that’d include you) such things as the facts are not important.

  19. Sandy P. Avatar

    — It is hard to believe now that this all stems from two flawed sentences in one unscripted early-morning interview, never repeated, when I said that the Government “probably knew” that the 45-minute figure was wrong.”–
    And 16 little words don’t matter, either, especially since it’s not Niger and the Brits still stand by their intel.
    —
    What we have been reminded of in the last 2-1/2 years is that words DO have consequences. He must be held to the same standards as the BBC wants to hold the government.
    If the BBC is not held to the same or higher standards, they also have no credibility. Those 2 flawed sentences sent Dr. Kelley down the road to eveyone’s final destination.

  20. jaed Avatar

    The cynical view: In the first shock there was the potential for them to have learned from this, but the wagons have circled at this point. Five will get you ten the Beeb rescinds its apology by the end of next week. Gilligan may even be re-hired by next month.

  21. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Instead, the BBC, all the way up to the Chairman of the Board of Governors, just blithely stuck with it
    Why not. It works for Bush. Or did he recently admit that his government made a big mistake on the WMD issue?
    >We can see that for people in ‘left-wing make-it-up-as-you-believe land’ (that’d include you) such things as the facts are not important.
    Gawd, it’s not like Gilligan made up a bunch of bald faced lies of the magnitude that Blair and Bush have.

  22. mike Avatar

    Bobby baby,
    An example of just one Bush or Blair “bald faced lie” if you please.

  23. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >An example of just one Bush or Blair “bald faced lie” if you please.
    Oh lordy, there are so many to choose from, but here are just a few.
    Those who say we haven’t found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they’re wrong. We found them.
    George Bush, Polish TV interview, 29 May 2003
    The Iraq Survey Group has already found massive evidence of a huge system of clandestine laboratories, workings by scientists, plans to develop long-range ballistic missiles.
    Tony Blair, on British Forces Broadcasting Service, 16 December 2003
    And here is one of my favorites from Donny.
    We know where they are. They’re in the area around Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south and north somewhat.
    Donald Rumsfeld, 30 March 2003
    If you need any more
    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5581.htm

  24. scott orrell Avatar
    scott orrell

    Robert,
    Are you suggesting that seasoned politicians- with incredible politicians’ gift for just barely speking the truth- would cynically use shaky intelligence data to back up thier private conclusions? (Feign shock)
    This is what leaders do, when confronted with national security issues like the continuing battles. They use the same data as everyone else, and they take risks with their credibility. That probably damages them poltically and personally , but they still can win a victory (to them) for the US. They did something hard to do: start a revolution. Four actually: in Afganistan, in Iraq, on the diplomatic stage, and in the military-industrial complex. Keeping down the path to a changed world is- to them- worth the cost of appearing fools. Because America also looks powerful, and good, for its action.

  25. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Because America also looks powerful, and good, for its action.
    You keep living in that dreamworld, sparky.

  26. Sandy P. Avatar

    Robert, they did, they did (remember the ramp and cylinders from late 02(?)) and they were until Jan/Feb of 03 when it was brought out at that time things were being moved out across the border. And that no one had thought to bomb the train tracks for one avenue of escape thru Syria.
    Ummm, not only read about your 2nd point, but saw on TV.

  27. SharpShooter Avatar

    Robert,
    Are YOU defending Gilligan? Are YOU representing yourself as an unofficial apologist for Andrew Gilligan, THE Andrew Gilligan who broadcast on BBC’s World Service radio broadcasts, (simulcast in 48 simultaneously-interpreted languages other than English) that HE was in Baghdad, and the lying Americans were NOT in Baghdad… even as al-Jazeera and FoxNews and CNN were broadcasting audio AND visual images of elated Iraqis tearing down a statue of the hated Hussein WITH THE HELP of American troops, in Baghdad?
    Are YOU, Robert, staking YOUR honesty on Gilligan’s “honesty”?
    Please reconsider your position in light of Gilligan’s morally moribund, egregiously distorted abuse of ‘honesty’ and ‘accurate reporting’…

  28. Doyne Dawson Avatar
    Doyne Dawson

    Notice that none of the statements (“lies” as he calls them) quoted by McClelland has been proven false so far. Rumsfeldt was very likely right to believe there were banned weapons in the area he mentioned, at the time he said this. It’s also possible the weapons were been already destroyed, or smuggled to Syria. McClelland is the type who always screams “They lied” when what he means is “They might have relied on faulty intelligence in some areas, though we don’t know for sure as yet.” These people poison the wells of public debate and they should be treated accordingly.

  29. Homer Robinson Avatar
    Homer Robinson

    There is only one true victim here, Kelly. I hope that his family finds some kind of peace, as they face the coming days, and years without him.

  30. Berend de Boer Avatar
    Berend de Boer

    Robert McClelland, I’m not sure what your actual argument is in this debate: it’s just two flawed sentences, so what’s the fuss? Using that logic, Blair had just one flaw in his intelligence report, the 45 minute claim, so what was Gilligan actually reporting about? I mean: it’s just a few words.
    You are conveniently forgetting that the claim was that the government sexed-up its report. Your not even addressing that, but you’re just sophistically side tracking the actual issues.
    Claiming, and standing by it as the BBC did, that the government went to war by lying to its people in order to convince them, is a serious allegation.
    Please address this. And don’t give me your weasel answers.
    PS: sorry to all the other posters that I had to spell this out.

  31. Berend de Boer Avatar
    Berend de Boer

    Sorry, one more thing: there’s a guy dead because he was misrepresented and used by Gilligan for his own anti-war, anti-Iraq, pro-continuing of torture and horror stance. Any thoughts on that Mr. McClelland?
    Just words? Or is one more death to the 100 million not very relevant?

  32. wretchard Avatar

    Robert McClelland,
    The Kay report said, “We have discovered hundreds of cases, based on both documents, physical evidence and the testimony of Iraqis, of activities that were prohibited under the initial UN resolution 687 and that should have been reported under 1441, with Iraqi testimony that not only did they not tell the UN about this, they were instructed not to do it and they hid the material”. However, they did not find the stockpiles of WMD that nearly everyone in the intelligence community, including David Kelly, the BBC’s source, had expected. Saddam himself was misled by his underlings into thinking that he had WMDs. That should be good news for the world. And I see it is good news for you, but not for the same reasons.

  33. Oxonian Avatar

    I can tell you this much from living in the middle of England. People here are shocked by the findings of the Hutton report. The BBC, although flawed, is a revered institution here, and people are finding it very hard to accept that Hutton should pillory the BBC while letting the govt go off scotch-free. While the BBC acted without due diligence, the govt took the country to WAR on an excuse that looks phonier by the day. So which fault is bigger in people’s eyes? Take a guess.
    The public mood here continues to be this: So if the BBC was so wrong and the govt was so right, where ARE those WMDs? Where is the casus belli? Why DID we go to war? The “liberate Iraq” excuse that plays so well in America has little appeal in this country, so unless the WMDs make a miracle appearance, this will turn out to be, as many people have already concluded, a pyrrhic victory for Tony Blair.

  34. Silver Avatar

    The whole affair points to the vast difference between press in the free enterprise system and press sponsored by government.
    Why was the NYTimes contrite over Blair? Because if they lost their credibility, they lost their revenue.
    Why won’t the Beeb be contrite over this? Because every Brit with a TV pays their salaries (through an unbelievably stupid tax).
    The world no longer needs the Beeb, and the Brits should not have to pay for it. Let the free market system determine the veracity of their reporting. The Beeb, as a ward of the state, should be abolished.

  35. Richard Aubrey Avatar
    Richard Aubrey

    The BBC’s treatment of Gilligan is, IMO, the key.
    He lied, flat lied, about the US military having gotten to the Baghdad airport. He said he was there and the Americans weren’t. Turns out he wasn’t and they were. That’s not a matter of nuance and interpretation. That’s a flat lie. We could go further and presume he was doing it to discredit US forces and reporting.
    But the presumption isn’t necessary.
    Knowing this, the BBC did not check his work when it was strongly contradicted by the government.
    Their treatment of him indicates that, at best, they didn’t care about liars (or they would have checked a known liar’s work), or, at worst, the BBC didn’t care about lying attempts to impugn what they, as an organization, didn’t like.
    In either case, it’s an indication that they are not to be trusted.
    It provides some support for those who say the BBC was deliberately cooking the books on one side of this issue. After all, in two cases which are as clear as a dead fly on your mashed potatos, it’s been proven. How about all those other cases where people looked and bitched but no further action occurred?

  36. hmm Avatar

    Ox – the ‘casus belli’ was outlined quite specifically in res 1441. if you believe the only excuse we (the Allied coalition) gave for war was the possibility of WMD’s you are gravely mistaken.
    we went to war for numerous and clearly outlined reasons – if some people choose not to recognize that, it is hardly anyone’s problem but their own.

  37. Andrea Harris Avatar

    I note that “Oxonian” says he lives in “the middle of England” — but by his nic he is either an Oxford student, employee, or graduate. I take the words on war from people affiliated with that admittedly august institution with very large grains of salt.

  38. Joe Peden Avatar
    Joe Peden

    Working back from Kelly’s suicide, it was easy to see that Gilligan had sexed up his story, and that it was this which precipitated Kelly’s suicide [but did not really “cause” it], not his discovery as a source or later “outing” by Blair.
    Kelly was already depressed when he met Gilligan. He then saw the sexed-up story and thought, basically, that this was too much respond to, or bear: that Gilligan had lied about what he said. How could he possibly prove otherwise? It was too much. This led him to the trigger.
    The alternative, that it was Kelly’s discovery as a source or “outing” by Blair which led him to the suicide, was absurd on its face: Kelly met with Gilligan. This was not going to be a secret and Kelly knew it. Why would Kelly tell Gilligan something which, if attatched to Kelly, whould cause him to commit suicide? He could certainly commit suicide without going through this step.
    The only conclusion at the time was that it was Gilligan who sexed-up the story, and that this precipitated Kelly’s suicide.
    [I posted this scenario at the time of Kelly’s suicide at Andrew Sullivan’s Letters area, but it did not appear. That is and was ok.]
    BTW, this McClellan guy demonstrates the typical Leftist defect of being unable to make sense. His thought is vague, fragmented, convenient, and not pinned to reality.
    Such people have another purpose for their alleged thought, which is to achieve some kind of gratification or control unrelated to any possiblitiy of making sense. They don’t know that it is possible to make sense, or even what it is. This is also what makes them real relativists. They can’t do anything else.

  39. rivlax Avatar

    It must say something about the Left that it invests whole careers in picking nits like “45 minutes” and “the 16 words” and trying to turn them into huge issues. It reminds me of the interminable debates in over what Marx was really trying to say. It’s all the last gasp of a dying ideology. I can’t wait for the funeral.

  40. shay Avatar

    “The only conclusion at the time was that it was Gilligan who sexed-up the story, and that this precipitated Kelly’s suicide.”
    But Gilligan then made it far worse for Kelly by sending emails to MPs questioning Kelly. Those emails breached the confidentiality of Gilligan’s colleague Susan Watts’s contact with Kelly & made it clear to Kelly that his lies & evasions to his management & MPs stood exposed.

  41. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Are YOU defending Gilligan?
    I wouldn’t know him if I backed over him with my truck. So I can’t very well defend him. My point was, however, that what he did has been blown all out of proportion and that Hutton’s remarks were over the top against the BBC.

  42. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Claiming, and standing by it as the BBC did, that the government went to war by lying to its people in order to convince them, is a serious allegation.
    ZZZZZ. Every left leaning media source in the world has claimed that Blair and Bush cooked the evidence of WMDs in order to lie the public into the war.

  43. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >It must say something about the Left that it invests whole careers in picking nits like “45 minutes” and “the 16 words” and trying to turn them into huge issues.
    The huge issue is the fact that the US implemented a policy of pre-emptive self defense in order to invade Iraq on the basis that it posed a threat to America. The huge issue is that Bush and Blair fabricated the notion that Iraq posed a threat to America by misrepresenting the intelligence data concerning Iraq’s WMDs.
    Whether you were for or against the war, I think it should be of great concern to you that the US exaggerated the threat posed by Iraq in order to justify implementing this new policy of pre-emptive self defense. It should be of great concern to you that the US may once again exaggerate the evidence against another country in order to justify invading it. I mean, what’s next? Will the US claim that Syria attacked an Iraqi radio station in order to justify invading Syria next?

  44. Pat Avatar

    you cast a chill over all journalism
    And you cast a chill over the blog community. Do some proper research into this subject before you pertist with these attacks on a good journalist who made one mistake. You have seriously damaged your reputation with your reaction to Hutton.

  45. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    No, anonymous, chick Pat do your research. This was the unprofessional twit who said that American forces were not in Baghdad when they were and then did not correct his mistake. This was the incompetent ass who accused the Blair government of sexing up the report and, to this day, won’t apologize for in fact lying himself. No, journalism is far better off without him. The crime is that it took so long to get rid of him. And that is why his bosses are gone, too, and deservedly so.

  46. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    Robert: Why don’t you just open comments on your blog and hold your salon there rather than trying to monopolize the conversation elsewhere?

  47. capt joe Avatar

    I think we finally have met the “Ugly Canadian”.
    With regards to the claim that Respective US and British governments have misrepresented intelligence data. The Hutton inquiry dealt with the British side.
    This morning the other shoe dropped.
    Check out the WaPo: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A64626-2004Jan30.html?nav=hptop_ts
    Two congressional investigations have shown that there is no proof that the CIA was pressured to give false evidence.
    So will the left get over it already.

  48. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Two congressional investigations have shown that there is no proof that the CIA was pressured to give false evidence.
    Nobody has claimed they were pressured. What is being claimed in the real world, as opposed to your fantasy land, is that Bush and Blair cherry picked the evidence that suited their purpose and discarded the rest, along with the caveats.

  49. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Robert: Why don’t you just open comments on your blog and hold your salon there rather than trying to monopolize the conversation elsewhere?
    Why did you add a comment feature to your site if you don’t want people to comment. And claiming that I’m monopolizing the conversation is absurd, Gilligan. . .er, I mean Jeff.

  50. Angus Jung Avatar
    Angus Jung

    “Robert: Why don’t you just open comments on your blog and hold your salon there rather than trying to monopolize the conversation elsewhere?”
    Because nobody would read it! :)

  51. capt joe Avatar

    iowahawk, great one.

  52. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    I killed the last two comments with personal attacks going back and forth. I killed the one defending me just to be even-handed. But I am fed up with certain people — and you damned well know who you are — getting nasty and personal and trying to hijack discussion.
    Let me say this one more time: This is my house. Behave in it. Or I’ll just shut it up and live here happily by myself. (Robert: I let you back in after banning you and you were behaving but this is getting out of hand again.)

  53. JohninLondon Avatar
    JohninLondon

    Tom Mangold, a veteran BBC repoer of the old school and a friend of the Kelly family makes it clear again that he thinks that Gilligan helped precipitate the suicide by revealing members of the Commons Foreign Affairs Committee that Dr Kelly was Susan Watts’ source :
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3440489.stm

  54. Robert McClelland Avatar

    >Robert: I let you back in after banning you and you were behaving but this is getting out of hand again.
    Sorry, Jeff. From now on I’ll restrain myself from making comments like, “I went to your blog. You suck.”

  55. Angus Jung Avatar
    Angus Jung

    Are you going to be okay, Robert? :(

  56. shay Avatar

    JohninLondon links above to the Tom Mangold article at BBCi – that article fails to mention that Gilligan had leaked the contents of that tape to MPs

  57. capt joe Avatar

    ah Robert, so much for that.
    Anyway…
    You have a great blog jeff. I appreciate your POV and agree with 80% of what you write. Good that you are taking control. I don’t read Atrios and Hesiod precisely because of that.

  58. capt joe Avatar

    Hmm, I remember Susan Watt’s testimony. She hired a lawyer after saying that the BBC was pressuring her to back Gilligan’s story. Form what I remember, she was saying that Dr Kelly was saying that Gilligan was misrepresenting his side. It was probably that tape amongst others that convined the inquiry.

  59. JohninLondon Avatar
    JohninLondon

    We haven’t heard the last of Susan Watts, maybe. If all this denial carries on, her evidence is going to be adduced again. Meanwhile the new internal enquiry at the BBC is bound to look at what pressure she was subjected to – in particular by Richard Sambrook.
    Sambrook’s future is still in jeopardy. IMHO he should have left already – he helped lead Greg Dyke, an otherwise talented albeit impulsive man, into total folly. Sambrook should have had Gilligan sacked directly after his nonsense in Baghdad, where he made a mockery of the BBC’s reputation for straight reporting of events.

  60. capt joe Avatar

    What do you make of the discussion between Lord Gilbert and Nick Clarke at http://dailyablution.blogs.com/the_daily_ablution/2004/01/bbc_news_presen.html ?
    There is an interesting audio segment wehre Lord Gilbert actually starts to talk about something and Nick cuts him off really quickly. Some people told Gilbert was going to bring up that subject about Watts and Sambrook.

  61. PJF Avatar

    Robert McClelland wrote:
    “ZZZZZ. Every left leaning media source in the world has claimed that Blair and Bush cooked the evidence of WMDs in order to lie the public into the war.”
    You made a couple of good points there, but of course you made them inadvertently (too sleepy, not paying attention).
    Yes, lots of left leaning media sources have made this claim. But nearly everyone knows they’re biased, and looks at their output on that basis. None of those other media sources suggested that government officials had told them the government lied; it was just what they ‘reckoned’. Private media organisations expressing private opinions do not concern the government greatly.
    But the BBC isn’t a private media organisation – it’s the official state broadcaster, funded by state enforcement. The BBC has a constitutional obligation to be fair, impartial and accurate. It is still widely believed by the (hoodwinked) UK populace to be fulfilling that obligation.
    So it shouldn’t surprise anyone (not even Robert McClelland if he should ever wake up) that if the highly esteemed official state broadcaster says that a government official accused the government of lying, the government is obviously going take more notice of that than, say the ‘Independent’ frothing, and react strongly to protect its reputation.
    The other inadvertently good point is the acknowledgement that the BBC is a left leaning media source. If more people would wake up to that fact the BBC would be finished as a state broadcaster – as it should be. The senior news staff have organised adverts in British newspapers demanding ‘independence’. I’m happy to oblige.

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    Bit of a dilemma in this for Blair. The trouble is that even with the phrase “sexed up” disposed of by Hutton, he is now in what’s been pithily called the Reagan Bind. Because whether the 45-minute claim got there as a result of deliberate malfeasance or mere incompetence (like, say, deliberately flying in the face of your own intel service) there’s no escaping the fact it was there. If we believe Hutton, then Gilligan credited Blair for a competence he apparently didn’t possess. He’s paid for that mistake — be interesting to see if Blair will now pay for his.

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