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Using the innocents, continued

27 comments on Using the innocents, continued

Using the innocents, continued

: I’ve changed my mind. I don’t want to redo the International Freedom Center to turn it from an flagellation fest into a celebration of democracy and freedom in America.

No, I want to eliminate it.

The memorial at the World Trade Center should say everything that needs to be said.

So in the place of the so-called Freedom Center, I want to see the truest expression of American freedom: commerce.

I want to see stores that sell scanty clothes, no burkas allowed.

I want to see restaurants that serve liquor.

I want to see movies that show anything, even sex.

I want to see bookstores that celebrate free speech.

I want to see stores selling products from all over the world: the fruits of globalization.

I want to see life there. Defiant, unapologetic life.

: Just to be clear (reacting to a comment): I am not talking about the memorial; I endorse the memorial. It is this — as Ed Cone put it — noise around that from the Freedom Center that is bothersome.

So don’t bother with the Freedom Center, not here. Let the memorial speak for itself. And hand the rest of the space back to the living. That’s what I’m trying to say, in my hyperbolic way.

27 responses to “Using the innocents, continued”

  1. jjoats Avatar
    jjoats

    TOON OF THE DAY: OK Science

  2. Ethan Avatar
    Ethan

    I’m pretty sure there would be “life” in the Memorial Center as well…thoughtful, sober life.
    And it’s mighty hypocritical of you to blast those for inserting a political agenda into the Memorial and then want the site to demonstrate “the fruits of globalization” (which, FWIW, I support whole-heartedly).

  3. Jeff Jarvis Avatar
    Jeff Jarvis

    Oh, yes, I have a political agenda: It is standing up for us and our way of life, defiantly.

  4. Scott Ferguson Avatar
    Scott Ferguson

    Yeah, Jeff. Let’s put a 100,000 sq ft Peep World at the WTC site, with glory holes between the movie booths, and a huge section of battery powered latex marital aids. That would be a fitting memorial to those who died at the hand of the intolerant.

  5. Ethan Avatar
    Ethan

    Apologies, but I think a Memorial Center honors the lost and acknowledges the event in a much more significant way–and a way much closer to our way of life–than a tacky shopping mall.

  6. Jeff Jarvis Avatar
    Jeff Jarvis

    Ethan: ABSOLUTELY! We agree. But there already is a memorial included. This is about the so-called International Freedom Center (follow the links to earlier coverage).
    Scott: Cool down, man.

  7. Ethan Avatar
    Ethan

    Ah. Reading Buzzmachine at work=not a good idea.
    I still think we should build a Freedom Center, though. But as others have said: let’s wait. 10, 15 years. We all need time.

  8. Michael Zimmer Avatar
    Michael Zimmer

    I’m not so sure about commerce being the fundamental expression of freedom. Perhaps a better way to reveal our freedoms is to make the space a place where people can go and speak out against our leadership (no matter who it might be decades from now). Perhaps the greatest thing about our free society is the ability to speak truth to power without fear of retribution.

  9. Mike Avatar
    Mike

    Again, what does 9/11 have to do with a Freedom Center? Absolutely nothing! We don’t need some freedom museum at this site. What happened there was a horrible, brutal terrorist attack where 3000 people lost their lives.
    Build the area back up, let it be the place it once was, but add a memorial that celebrates the lives of those that were killed there and the heroes that perished there. That’s all. We don’t need to turn the entire area into some cultural center with a political bend to it.
    This area was all about commerce before, what a better way to say to the Muslim terrorists nutjobs than building the area back to original purpose.

  10. Right of Center Avatar
    Right of Center

    The site is a place of attack, like Pearl Harbor. The should be no political content whatsoever. A lot of innocent people died there for no good reason. Any monument erected there should only serve to remind future generations of WHAT took place there. Let THEM decide WHY it took place.
    A monument in celebration of the “fruits of globalization” should be place in the public square in front of the “Turtle Bay Condo’s” on the site of the dismantled UN.

  11. Paul W. Swansen Avatar
    Paul W. Swansen

    For a bookstore that celebrates free speech, look here to Denver and The Tattered Cover.

  12. mary Avatar
    mary

    A fitting memorial – we could rebuild the twin towers in the newly Saud/Wahhabi-free, refurbished downtown Riyadh.

  13. Patricia Avatar
    Patricia

    The cultural center should be completely eliminated. No compromise. Hey Bloomberg, I will not spend a nickel in NYC again if it stays. It’s an insult to those who died and who tried to save them and part of a new “branding” of Democratic politics. Why else would these guys be involved as partners, and Joe Trippi as the head of “engagement”?

  14. DSmith Avatar
    DSmith

    We already have an International Freedom Center. It’s called the United States of America.

  15. whodat Avatar
    whodat

    It’s ironic that the people in favor of the IFC are probably the same ones who were not in favor of going into Iraq and liberating them from years of heinous oppression and dictatorship.
    I think of my life here. I think of what it would be like to live there, grow up there and work there. I’m happy for them that perhaps not this generation in total, but the next will know freedom.

  16. Jersey Exile Avatar
    Jersey Exile

    For once I agree with you wholeheartedly, Jeff.

  17. Ethan Avatar
    Ethan

    “It’s ironic that the people in favor of the IFC are probably the same ones who were not in favor of going into Iraq and liberating them from years of heinous oppression and dictatorship.
    I think of my life here. I think of what it would be like to live there, grow up there and work there. I’m happy for them that perhaps not this generation in total, but the next will know freedom.”
    FYI, many of us who opposed the war did so on the grounds that, while overthrowing Saddam was a more than noble goal, the means by which our Administration sought to achieve it–by alienating the rest of the world, by offering up a WMD motive that seemed specious from the beginning–were reprehensible and ultimatly counterproductive in the War on Terror.

  18. Barry Avatar
    Barry

    I don’t want the IFC either, my method of “defiance” would basically mean rebuilding the WTC 1 story taller like Trump wants.
    Jeff, your “defiance” is simply “intolerance.” Whatever happened to America being a melting pot of people and their cultures? There are plenty of burka wearing Muslims living within our borders that drive the speed limit and don’t kill 3,000 people on a daily basis.
    Is it really that horrible to try to respect everyone?

  19. Josh Avatar
    Josh

    The burka is not a symbol of freedom, it is more like a monument to oppression (of women).
    And when you enter a building, you should take your hat off, whatever kind of hat you wear. That’s just proper manners, nothing to do with repressing other people’s cultures. Muslim women are expected never to take their head coverings off, because women are less than second class citizens in countries with muslim governments. So I’m with Jeff on this one, those women should integrate with the American culture.

  20. Barry Avatar
    Barry

    “those women should integrate with the American culture.”
    Wow, ok, so much for the idea of the “melting pot. I guess someone appointed Josh “President of Everyone’s Customs” and didn’t tell me – you’d better hope your religious/cultural customs are acceptable to him.
    So, Orthodox Jews should have to remove their Yamuka (sp?) when entering buildings too? What about the Pope? Can he wear his hat inside?

  21. whodat Avatar
    whodat

    Alienating the rest of the world? They waited 12 years for him to comply with the UN. All he had to do was open his doors. Instead, he chose to play macho man and have innocent civilians suffer the consequences of severe sanctions. Where were the desperate cries about these innocent Iraqi people for 12 years? Now because of the war people have all this care for them? It’s such a joke. It’s just a bunch of Bush haters.

  22. Ethan Avatar
    Ethan

    “Alienating the rest of the world? They waited 12 years for him to comply with the UN. All he had to do was open his doors. Instead, he chose to play macho man and have innocent civilians suffer the consequences of severe sanctions. Where were the desperate cries about these innocent Iraqi people for 12 years? Now because of the war people have all this care for them? It’s such a joke. It’s just a bunch of Bush haters.”
    Well, you don’t actually seem to deny the charge; you just don’t think it’s that big of a problem. There were a lot of cries on the left about the innocent Iraqi people for those twelve years–mostly against the sanctions. You can argue that the sanctions were in fact necessary, but those who opposed the sanctions did so out of moral consideration for the Iraqi people. That’s why some on the far left–see Jason West, new Paltz mayor–actually supported the war, because they viewed it as a better deal than the sanctions.

  23. Ethan Avatar
    Ethan

    Hey–back to the subject at hand–why not just build a beautiful park/library of some sort? I tend to think shopping would trivialize what happened.

  24. Mike Avatar
    Mike

    Jeff, your “defiance” is simply “intolerance.” Whatever happened to America being a melting pot of people and their cultures?
    Barry, are you joking? Melting Pot? Cultures? We are talking about 9/11 here! What Jeff says here in no way equates to intolerance. Just build this dumb museum somewhere else, it has nothing to do with 9/11.
    Basically, nothing new should be added to this site that wasn’t there before with the exception of a memorial. We don’t need a freedom center in this country, like DSmith said, we are a freedom center!

  25. whodat Avatar
    whodat

    And the sanctions didn’t work. And though they didn’t find WMD now, it’s documented there were before and he had plans, also documented, to acquire and make more. Liberating Iraq and ridding the world of the modern day Hitler is the end that was necessary. I agree that the means and how the administration handled the war and why they chose at that certain time are definitely up for debate.

  26. John Avatar
    John

    Sorry Ethan,
    Hussein’s regime was most closely Stalinist in nature.
    To put things a little bit in perspective, perhaps we should create a memorial to all of the victims of Sociali*m.
    We can include the victims of National Sociali*m, Soviet Sociali*m, and all the other wanna be sociali*ms. And for good measure, let’s throw in the 15,000 or so who perished in France during the vacation time heat wave of several summers ago, and all of the elderly who die due to medical care rationing in these enlightened societies.
    In the Twentieth Century, Sociali*m was the hands down body count leader.
    Let’s acknowledge that fact and begin the discussion thereafter.

  27. Jeff Avatar
    Jeff

    Jeff, I’m surprised you aren’t being more responsible in explaining the layout and planning of the World Trade Center site. Why have you given in so easily to this freakout over the IFC straw man? Half the people in your comments don’t even understand the difference between the IFC and the actual memorial, and I’m not even sure you understand that the IFC is part of a cultural center for the arts. And as for all this stuff you list, except for the burka part, what do you think will be in the jillions of square feet of shopping at the new World Trade Center?
    I know the point of a blog is for you to blow off steam, but people are taking you seriously as their source of reporting on this topic. Why don’t you wipe the spittle off your screen and use your respected position to bring some actual information and understanding to this matter? The discussion and debate over how to use the area known as Ground Zero is complicated and deep and active and relatively open. To jump in the middle like this with sudden upset over this one aspect makes no sense.