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Nannymania

38 comments on Nannymania

Nannymania

: The atmosphere of nannyism in this country has gotten out of hand. First farts (below), now Eve’s breasts.

He painted Eve as God created her: nude.

And when he finished including the bare-bosomed Biblical first woman, he inscribed the word “love” on the mural that covers the outside wall of his Roseville art studio.

In Ed (Gonzo) Stross’ eyes, his variation on Michelangelo’s “Creation of Man” mural is art.

In 39A District Judge Marco Santia’s eyes, it’s a crime….

Santia ordered Stross, 43, to serve 30 days in jail, do two years’ probation and pay a $500 fine for violating a city sign ordinance. Roseville officials said letters were prohibited on the mural and Eve’s exposed chest is indecent.

Besides jail time and the fee, Stross is to tastefully cover Eve’s breasts before reporting to the Macomb County Jail on Monday morning, and to paint over “love” by May 1….

ACLU Legal Director Michael J. Steinberg said someone from his office planned to meet with Stross later Thursday to discuss representing him.

“It’s a sad day in America when an artist goes to jail for reproducing a Michelangelo painting on the side of his art studio,” Steinberg said….

He said he plans to raise money for the fine and probation costs. Stross, who has multiple sclerosis and receives disability payments, said money is tight.

[Thanks, Movieboy]

38 responses to “Nannymania”

  1. Gregg Avatar
    Gregg

    Um, so now we’re against laws (such as sign ordinances) that restrict public nudity?

  2. Mike Avatar
    Mike

    Give me a break. Nannyism?? What are you talking about? Like Gregg said, this sounds more like someone who just ignored a city ordinance. There are plenty of stories like this out there involving regular signs/banners/flags etc.
    Not sure you’re angle here, but it has nothing to do with a violation of free speech. Which is what I’m assuming your lumping this into.

  3. Privacy Watch Avatar
    Privacy Watch

    OMG! It sounds like he got the maximum sentence possible for a misdemeanor. (I’m not sure what the max is in his state.) Absolutely outrageous. Even if you were in favor of the prudish sign ordinance, the sentence is way out of proportion. It is more than people get for first time fraud, grand theft or assault.
    Gregg: a painting is not “public nudity.” It sounds like you think Aschroft was doing a public service when he put a drape on the bare bosom of classic stature of “Lady Justice” that resides in the Justice department. Wow, if he hadn’t, perhaps the local DA could have him thrown in jail for obscenity.

  4. Gregg Avatar
    Gregg

    I meant to say “any public displays/representations of nudity.” Like Mike said, this isn’t nannyism. Not all speech is free. If you’d like, we could arrange for a 50 foot tall image of sexual intercourse to be installed on the largest billboard of your hometown. Instead, municipalities have decided to restrict what can be used as signage.

  5. Mike Avatar
    Mike

    I do agree that the penalty seems rather harsh. Jail time is way over the top for something like this, in fact, it’s just stupid and unnecessary. But the artist knew the rules ahead of time, according to the article:
    In 1997, the city’s Zoning Board of Appeals granted him a variance to a sign ordinance. It allowed him to paint the 1,100-square-foot wall under these conditions: no letters, no inclusion of genitalia and regular maintenance of the artwork.
    Curious why the artist would then violate the agreement.

  6. Mark Avatar
    Mark

    My question is “Was his painting any good?” We’ve grown altogether too tolerant of bad art.

  7. Franky Avatar
    Franky

    I’m in full agreement with Jeff and this case is a good one because it reveals not only the warped sensibility that could view a woman’s breast as obscene but also the real barnyard sense of culture these guardians of the decent possess.
    To the supporters of this move, shall we restrict admittance to the museums of our country, because you know in all likelihood there’s going to be some nudity? God forbid our children, “the children!!!”, see a picasso.

  8. oodja Avatar
    oodja

    Mike,
    When exactly did breasts become “genitalia”? Sounds like the only thing the artist did that was illegal was the inclusion of lettering in the mural.
    30 days jail-time, 2 years probation, and a $500 fine? I’m surprised the judge didn’t order the baliff to cut the guy’s hands off while he was at it.
    And yet somehow our enemies “hate us for our freedoms”. Must contemplate this one while the Christofascists slowly but surely implement their version of sharia here in America…

  9. jeremy in NYC Avatar
    jeremy in NYC

    Gregg: You really don’t see any difference between a 50-foot display of intercourse and a representation of a Michaelangelo painting that includes a bare breast?
    Well, you just made the case for me that this is about nannyism.

  10. Jim Nelson Avatar
    Jim Nelson

    Don’t you know, if a picture of naked people is more than 200 years old, it’s art. If it’s less than 200 years old, it’s porn. Really, we have to have some standards, or else you’ll have dogs and cats canoodling together in the streets for God’s sake.

  11. Gregg Avatar
    Gregg

    I know the difference. Whether or not the city’s sign ordinance makes such differences explicit (pardon the pun) is the issue. If it only bans “genitalia,” then he arguably didn’t violate the ordinance – depending, of course, on whether the ordinance defines that is meant by that term.

  12. Andy Avatar
    Andy

    Way off topic: check google news right now!
    Heading up their U.S. section:
    Negroponte Joins Dark Power Shadows
    An article from our good friends in Cuba with their oh-so-fair take on Negroponte’s appointment. Perhaps I shouldn’t be trusting Google News’ choice in preferred news outlets anymore?
    Screenshot and link at my blog.

  13. Shinobi Avatar
    Shinobi

    Well dictionary.com defines genetalia as “The Genitals” and it defines Genitals as “external sex organs” Are breasts a sex organ? Sounds like semantics to me.

  14. worrywart Avatar
    worrywart

    Mike and Gregg, let me just start by saying I have nothing to say to you because responding to the nonsense you spout is counterproductive.
    Now, for everyone who clicked the link, read the story, and saw the actual picture on the wall. I’m as shocked as you are. Having been a jury member in cases like this, the judge has fairly strict authority to instruct the jury on the letter of the law and what intents are being questioned here. And to interpret the violation of the variance in this way is quite unprecedented. What’s even worse is that the no lettering provision was most probably a safeguard that the murial would not become advertising, not preventing lettering that is actually part of the art itself. As for the indecency of the breast, I’m surprised they didn’t also claim that God’s naked chest was indecent… after all, naked male chests are just as erotic as naked female chests if they’re hunky.
    So, all I have to say is shame on the Roseville officials for bringing this to court when they could have probably amicably settled this (or are they the ones after the publicity, even though they’re accusing Stross of that). And shame on Judge Marco Santia who seems to be a an accomplice to the Roseville official’s plot.

  15. Michael Zimmer Avatar
    Michael Zimmer

    Sign ordances that ban “genitalia” seem to be a reasonable exception to one’s freedom of speech.
    Defining the breasts as “obscene” is arguable, but the Supreme Court says we should defer to the “commuinity standards.” Perhaps it is a community of nannies.
    I’d have to agree, though, that it seems harsh to impose such a steep penalty for this guys mural. $500 fine for violating a sign ordinance seems ok – but jail time? C’mon.

  16. Dave_Violence Avatar
    Dave_Violence

    From what I gather, “everyone” is in agreement that if something is offensive on the radio or TV, changing the channel or turning the machine off is the “best” way to handle it. …and making sure we’re aware of what our kids are listening to, watching, etc. is all part of being a good parent.
    Well, what happens when there’s no “off” switch? I can roll up my windows in the car so I don’t have to hear the obscenities from the unwashed masses, right? But what am I supposed to do if I, literally, HAVE to look at something that’s “obscene”? I have to look at traffic lights (though it’s apparrently optional in New York), but why should I have to look at a “dirty mural” every day on my way to work? Should I opt for a different way to the office? OK, so now I’m inconvenienced for the sake of “art.” Is that fair?

  17. MWB Avatar
    MWB

    “Wilson Kolb” got himself banned the other day (and rightly so) for his annoying insistence that Jeff should connect the dots in the Gannon/Guckert story in a particular way, and that any failure to do so meant one was a stooge for the Bush administration.
    Similarly, though less gratingly in most cases, Jeff insists that we see every push and pull in the area of free expression as evidence that “prigs” “prudes” and “nannies” are taking over the country, and failure to do so makes one an “enemy of the First Amendment.” Thus are animosities stoked and divisions widened.
    Is this story evidence of out-of-hand nannyism? We don’t know. It’s a local conflict that could spring from any number of antecedents. But it appears here because it seems, on the surface, to fit Jeff’s template of a national First Amendment crisis.
    The truth of the matter is that controversies over the limits of free speech have existed between reasonable people for more than two centuries in this relatively healthy democracy. Bad decisions are made, and then get corrected. Gray areas are negotiated. Things get worked out. Democracy works and the republic survives.
    Sensationalism, while perhaps good for SiteMeter numbers, does not help this process.

  18. Michael Zimmer Avatar
    Michael Zimmer

    Very well said, MWB.

  19. Kat Avatar
    Kat

    It’s likely because of the religious aspect, not the boobies. Those anti-religion nutjobs are just pissed because this guy gives credence to Eve and thus the story of creation, and in the land of liberal nutjobs, that’s a no no–it’s only a fairytale and has no place on a sign. It pisses off the Bill Mahers and other bigots. These nannies want us indoctrinated in liberalism, not religion.Put up a nude Marx or Maureen Dowd or Madalyn Murray O’Hair or two gay guys bopping and there won’t be a peep.
    Bill Maher says “Christians suffer from a neurological disorder that stops people from thinking.We are a nation that is unenlightened because of religion. I do believe that. I think that religion stops people from thinking. I think religion is a neurological disorder. If you look at it logically, it’s something that was drilled into your head when you were a small child. It certainly was drilled into mine at that age. And you really can’t be responsible when you are a kid for what adults put into your head.” We should instead drill in gay marriage, porn, abortion is beautiful, and all kinds and Maheristian crapola. The atmosphere of leftist nannyism in this country has gotten out of hand–they can all screw themselves . I like the mural:).

  20. carsonfire Avatar
    carsonfire

    Once more, “freedom of speech” for the left comes down to “my right to shove this in your freaking face you blue-nosed a-hole”.
    What right does that artist have to display nudes to children in public, eh? Painting the word “LOVE” along with it is cunningly manipulative, and has elicited just the right response from people on the left.
    I have nudes on my website, but there is no political statement used to hide the true purpose (fun), and I warn surfers about it ahead of time when I can, instead of just pushing it in their faces unannounced. If I were to blow up one of those nudes and stick them on the side of my house, I would no longer be an artist or cartoonist: I would be a public nuisance and self-proclaimed pervert.
    The Michelangelo dodge is besides the point. This is one step away from going to the park and flashing people. I wish you people would drop your ideologies for a minute and really think about what the hell it is you’re really defending.

  21. SloppyDawg Avatar
    SloppyDawg

    The Michelangelo dodge is besides the point. This is one step away from going to the park and flashing people. I wish you people would drop your ideologies for a minute and really think about what the hell it is you’re really defending.
    What we’re defending is free expression, something that as an artist, you should understand, Carsonfire. How about if, instead of nudity (and I don’t mean pornography), the argument went along these lines instead:
    “Carsonfire, those elves and such that you draw are offensive and a disgrace to Christianity. God created no such beings. By promoting these drawings, you promote Godlessness and Satanism. You must now be punished by serving 30 days in jail, two years’ probation and pay a $500 fine for violating societal standards.”
    By defending Ed (Gonzo) Stross, we’re defending you too.
    Your welcome.

  22. carsonfire Avatar
    carsonfire

    You’re — defending me from a fictional construct that you just made up that couldn’t possibly happen in the US? Religious persecution of that type, these days, is more likely to be practiced by the left, as they are doing in Sweden for jailing a preacher for making anti-gay noises in a sermon.
    For the record, I *have* been censored, sort of… by some colleges and PayPal. I have no problem with that, because neither have hampered my ability to publish. Colleges have blocked my site for content, and PayPal sent me a notice about their TOS. For PayPal, I removed some material from my site, but I can *freely* publish it elsewhere, somewhere where I don’t have to use PayPal’s service.
    Religious people do have a problem with elves and faeries, but what are they going to do? Burn some books? Even that doesn’t really affect my ability to publish.
    Freedom of speech is *not* an equation with shoving objectionable material in people’s faces *against their will*. That’s what a nude mural does. That’s what Janet Jackson’s boob does during a live Superbowl broadcast. Playboy magazine, on the other hand, and even Hustler, has to be purchased; internet porn has to be (well, should have to be) sought out; it’s the “in-your-face” aspect that makes all of this objectionable.
    I know some will never understand this. I know there are plenty of people who don’t understand why it’s wrong to curse a blue streak in front of other people’s kids. You may have a right to curse a blue streak, but parents have a right to protect themselves and their children from your juvenile irresponsibility.

  23. Skate Avatar
    Skate

    “It’s likely because of the religious aspect, not the boobies. Those anti-religion nutjobs are just pissed because this guy gives credence to Eve and thus the story of creation, and in the land of liberal nutjobs, that’s a no no–it’s only a fairytale and has no place on a sign.”
    Kat, you really are an intolerant boob, and intellectually dishonest–if you can even be considered intellectuall in the slightest. It is the religious zealots, like John Ashcroft and the Taliban who are against nudity, not, in general, atheists, agnostics or the non religious.

  24. SloppyDawg Avatar
    SloppyDawg

    You’re — defending me from a fictional construct that you just made up that couldn’t possibly happen in the US?
    Well it actually is happening in the U.S., as is evidenced by the Free Press story. A guy painted his wall. Some people don’t like it so they’re sending him to jail. Jail. For a painting. Based on a well-known piece of art. Jail. Also, what I did was make a point. One man’s trash is another man’s treasure and I don’t want you, or anyone else telling me which is which.
    “Objectionable material”? A mural based on a Michaelangelo fresco? Gimme a break. It’s not like it was a painting of a guy f’ing a dog (something Rick Santorum might get a kick out of, since he refers to it all the time). What it is, is probably the first real work of art some kids will see in their lives. It’s a chance for parents to open kids’ eyes to the world of art. Or do they have to be 21 to enter the Sistine Chapel or MoMA?
    Religious persecution of that type, these days, is more likely to be practiced by the left, as they are doing in Sweden for jailing a preacher for making anti-gay noises in a sermon.
    That’s not likely here, now is it? I mean after all, Jerry Falwell blamed 9/11 on “sodomites” on national TV, but he’s not in jail, is he? That’s a shining example of the First Amendment at work. On the opposite end of that, we’re throwing a guy in jail because he painted a picture.
    You may have a right to curse a blue streak
    And I don’t curse a blue streak in front of kids. Well, maybe just at Giants games when it’s third and long and they give the ball to Ron Dayne. But that’s it.

  25. Eileen Avatar
    Eileen

    We don’t get a complete picture of any legal case in a short article. It’s the usual pick and choose your ‘facts’ routine, based upon the slant and bias of the writer.
    This guy’s been battling the city for years, at least since 1997 (if not well before). Apparently he received a clearly defined variance to the city sign ordinance from the Zoning Appeals Board which he violated. According to another article at: http://washtimes.com/upi-breaking/20040811-035514-2215r.htm, “City Manager John Knapp said Stross was granted a zoning variance to allow him to paint a mural on the wall of his business. Knapp said there were certain stipulations, including “there would be no breasts.” You can bet your boobies there was some Basis for arriving at that particular stipulation. More missing facts. If you had them, might you possibly even Agree with the terms of the variance? Or would you just categorically object to it without even knowing them or their validity?
    The jury was out only 20 minutes = slam dunk. The sentence was in all likelihood based on Stross’ ‘in your face, city’ flagrant violations (hint: as in, no words allowed, but he included one anyway, LOVE, in an ‘I Dare you to come after me on That one! move)/multiple refusals to comply with city mandates to adhere to the variance/who knows what else in terms of the guy’s history with the city on other sign issues/prior record, Etc.
    It is just So easy to sit here and bash, brush with broad strokes, and conclude it’s Nannies Gone Wild without knowing what the hell the full story is, isn’t it?
    Sorry (in more ways than one), but there’s ‘more to it than meets the eye’ here. The mural doesn’t bother me a bit, but apparently the people in Roseville have an interest in enforcing their own laws. Imagine that.
    And if you don’t like the laws, folks, the limits, the lines in the sand, the definitions of gray on ANY particular issue across the spectrum related to farts, fuck or frescoes, go change them. That’s the way it works. Go volunteer many, many long hours (for free?) on Roseville’s Zoning Board. Run for office, get a law degree and fight some fights. Write to Roseville’s City Council or Michigan’s congresspeople. Hell, move there and vote the judge out the next time around. You have so Very many options. That’s the true beauty of our system. As did/does artist Stross still, even, yet.
    As MWB eloquently stated on all counts and particularly here: “Democracy works and the republic survives.”

  26. Franky Avatar
    Franky

    “Painting the word “LOVE” along with it is cunningly manipulative, and has elicited just the right response from people on the left. I have nudes on my website, but there is no political statement used to hide the true purpose (fun)”
    God Bless the Republicans – only they could see the open statement of “love” as a “political statement used to hide the ture purpose”
    I wake daily and praise Jesus I am not one of these people. And in my darker moods I reflect on how much better the world would be without them.

  27. Eileen Avatar
    Eileen

    “God Bless the Republicans – only they could see the open statement of “love” as a “political statement used to hide the ture purpose”.”
    Although I don’t purport to speak for Carsonfire since you quoted him, you don’t think this guy might have intentionally (oh my) used the word love for political purposes? Cunningly manipulative AND in your face ‘I Dare you to prosecute me’ are the likely scenarios of what this guy did given the history available in two brief articles. How hard is it to understand ‘no words are allowed’ stated in a sign variance?
    Since the guy’s been fighting over this for at least nine years, the likelihood is that since he knew he couldn’t include words by the terms of the variance to begin with, and since he knew he’d be required to take them down, he included one which would he hoped in the process would either 1.) make the city out to be the bad guy in his ‘highly visible’ local battle, and/or, 2.) manipulate the city into Not enforcing its own variance (the terms of which he didn’t agree with in the first place). He knew that when he had to ERASE the word LOVE, it would ‘appear’ to make the city out to be the bad guy. Hence Carsonfire’s use of the term cunningly manipulative. Hence my characterization as a dare or legal maneuver.
    Which means, Franky, that your artist and the lefties who ‘bite’ are the ones who in truth and reality are taking the word love in vain.
    So who needs to be praying for whom?
    “And in my darker moods I reflect on how much better the world would be without them.”
    That’s Pretty Damn Dark. Better do some more praying. I’ll do some non-Republican, non-religious praying of my own for you.

  28. Jeff Hess Avatar
    Jeff Hess

    Shalom Y

  29. carsonfire Avatar
    carsonfire

    I feel like ducking from all the huge leaps going around in here.
    Dawg says: “Well it actually is happening in the U.S., as is evidenced by the Free Press story.”
    “It” being his fictional construct. Let’s look at that again, Dawg: “Carsonfire, those elves and such that you draw are offensive and a disgrace to Christianity. God created no such beings. By promoting these drawings, you promote Godlessness and Satanism. You must now be punished by serving 30 days in jail, two years’ probation and pay a $500 fine for violating societal standards.”
    So you are saying that a man who is being punished for violation of reasonable city ordinances that he is willfully flouting is proof that court imposed religious persecution including jail time and fines for depicting elves is occurring elsewhere? Where and how do you arrive at this amazing conclusion?
    Wait, wait, I’ve got an even better one for you: the fact that I once got a speeding ticket is proof that the police force is systematically targetting people of Swedish descent. What, no evidence that the police are doing such a preposterous thing? My speeding ticket from ten years ago begs to differ!
    Mr Hess has it exactly right. This is, in fact, not much different from a neighborhood association dispute. Instead of a resident wanting to paint his house a non-approved color, here’s a disgruntled artist with an ax to grind. The artist’s case isn’t a bit more about freedom of speech than the guy who wants to paint his house.
    But it’s kind of amusing seeing this tossed up as another example of “censorship”, because one of the complaints about the FCC has been about how “unpredictable” they are. Why, how can we air anything if we don’t know what the FCC is going to do from day to day? Here, we’ve got a case with clearly defined and utterly reasonable statutes being broken, and the same people are still complaining. This is why Republicans and Christians tend to be wary of overly-hyped arguments against regulation. Too often, it becomes very apparent that the left is fighting very, very hard to impose social anarchy.
    Oh, one more thing: any real artist will bristle at the suggestion that a COPY of a masterpiece is art, especially a wobbly copy on a mural defaced with extraneous material (“LOVE”… the guy must have thought he was redecorating Pepperland). A copy is copy, NOT ART. Those tin foil hats must do something to one’s aesthetics, on top of the ability to reason and arrive at coherent logic.

  30. mw Avatar
    mw

    Morons. Now Michigan is going to be the latest laughingstock. First, breasts are NOT ‘genitalia’ in any normal sense of the word. Genitals are sex organs. Breasts are not genitals. Second, he clearly did violate the ordinance by including the letters (which, I assume, makes it a ‘commercial sign’ rather than just a work of art). So the court should have ordered him to paint over the letters or paint over the entire thing. It’s just simple common sense–how do we end up with judges that lack even that?

  31. Kat Avatar
    Kat

    skate–Take a pill,eat some brainfood, and lighten up-I was being facetious–blaming atheists is no different than blaming Christians, without having facts.
    (Dawg-That’s not likely here, now is it?)It already has–5 people were jailed for preaching at a gay rally in Philadelphia. They were peaceful, but just said unliberal things and got thrown in jail.

  32. SloppyDawg Avatar
    SloppyDawg

    5 people were jailed for preaching at a gay rally in Philadelphia. They were peaceful, but just said unliberal things and got thrown in jail.
    Kat, I just looked up a story about that case, and indeed, those people’s rights to free speech was violated.

  33. SloppyDawg Avatar
    SloppyDawg

    Oh, one more thing: any real artist will bristle at the suggestion that a COPY of a masterpiece is art, especially a wobbly copy on a mural defaced with extraneous material (“LOVE”… the guy must have thought he was redecorating Pepperland). A copy is copy, NOT ART.
    I suppose that’s a lecture, coming from you, a REAL artist. But once again, that’s a matter of taste and I’d rather not have anyone tell me what I can or can’t look at.
    As far as copies go, I don’t have an art history background but I imagine that through the ages, there must be quite a bit of homage from artists paying tribute to others.
    And I seem to remember Andy Warhol’s Campbell soup can print making quite a stir.
    And there ain’t no tinfoil hats here. The right-wing must have bought them all up when this was going on.

  34. Privacy Watch Avatar
    Privacy Watch

    “skate–Take a pill,eat some brainfood, and lighten up-I was being facetious–blaming atheists is no different than blaming Christians, without having facts. ”
    I’m all for facetious, but I must say that sarcasm isn’t easy to detect in print. Perhaps if there were a special font, Sarcastica, so that everyone would know.

  35. Kat Avatar
    Kat

    Well, I did put a :), but next time I’ll just spell sarcasm and put it in brackets, OK?

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    Karen

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