Bush: As confused as everybody else on indecency

Bush: As confused as everybody else on indecency

: On the one hand, George Bush defends the First Amendment in an interview on C-SPAN this weekend. But then he seems to realize that he has just painted himself in the corner, so he turns around and defends Michael Powell, too. Such is life on the slipperly slope.

But note that George Bush does say that the first and best reaction to what you consider indecent is not government regulation but the remote control.

Go with it, George. Go with it.

From Broadcasting & Cable’s coverage, the transcript (full C-SPAN transcript here):

LAMB: … one of the big issues moving around Capitol Hill is indecency. And I want to ask you, how far do you think government should go in telling people who use the airwaves, the broadcast stations, what can be said?

PRESIDENT: As a free speech advocate, I often told parents who were complaining about content, you’re the first line of responsibility; they put an off button on the TV for a reason. Turn it off.

Amen. But he continues:

PRESIDENT: I do think, though, that there can be a — that government can, at times, not censor, but call to account programming that gets over the line. The problem, of course, is the definition “over the line.”

Well, but Mr. President, that is censorship. And, yes, that is precisely the problem: Where is the line and who draws it? Should it be government? No, it should not. You know that, in your heart of hearts. Go with it, George. Go with it.

PRESIDENT: My answer would be, if I were interviewing an FCC chairman, please tell me where the line is, and make sure you protect the capacity of people to speak freely in our society, but be willing to — if things get too far, call them to account. I think Michael did a good job of balancing that.

Mighty tight corner you just painted yourself into, Pres.

LAMB: There is a bill that if it were passed on Capitol Hill would up the fees, up the fine from $27,000 for using bad language, for instance, to $500,000 as a maximum fee.

Actually, that’s only the fine per incident. The maximums go up to $3 million. That is a serious chill on free speech. That is the intent of the legislation: to chill free speech. But to the President, it’s amusing:

THE PRESIDENT: Well, they’re going to collect a lot of money when some of these TV shows are still on.

I’m not laughing, George.

LAMB: But is that — I mean, at what point, though, do you have somebody that says, that word can’t be used, but that word can be used?

THE PRESIDENT: No, I understand. Look, it’s the old — the classic definition of the Supreme Court — by the Supreme Court on pornography, you know it when you see it. I think that was Judge Potter Stewart who said that.

That was, I believe, what the court said on obscenity and that’s not what we’re talking about here. We’re talking about indecency on broadcast. He continues:

PRESIDENT: Look, we are a great society because we’re a free society. On the other hand, it is very important for there to be limits, limits to what parents have to explain to their children. Nevertheless, I do want to repeat what I said earlier — the parent’s first responsibility is to pay attention to what their children listen to, whether it be rock songs or movies or TV shows.

The poor man just gave himself whiplash flipflopping like that.

Let me help you out here, George: You are a Republican. You believe in small government. You abhor regulation. You should kill the FCC. Go with it, George. Go with it.

6 responses to “Bush: As confused as everybody else on indecency”

  1. Matthew Goggins Avatar

    When you’re right, you’re right, Mr. Jarvis.
    But please maintain your empathy for the president. Nobody’s perfect, and his heart does seem to be in the right place.
    It’s not like there’s an overwhelming mass movement against indecency regulation, with hordes of angry ciitizens demanding to scrap the FCC, and President Bush is just mulishy standing in their way shouting “You shall not pass!!”

  2. JRP Avatar

    Are you advocating there should be no line? That we should allow porn to displace Saturday morning cartoons on VHF?
    Obviously not. Welcome to the real world, where there there _is_ a line to free expression. Thanks for joining us.
    And, there _was_ a question about the Janet Jackson thing, as to who knew what and when. So, we spank the network that allowed it, and allow their self interest (which is, keeping dollars in their pocket) to get them to do things more carefully. It’s not going to bust the bank, but we can make it painful. Nobody’s right to free speech was, in fact, violated, the ‘gun shy’ reaction by some networks notwithstanding: for instance not showing a reasonably redacted ‘Saving Private Ryan’, and making a big stink over it, was a political stunt, nothing more.
    Remember the ’50s? Probably not. Remember reruns from the 50s? Then, ask yourself this: are the writing, stories, and plots (the _ideas_ expressed) particularly better now? Or, from a later period, is NYPD Blue any better than Hill Street Blues was? Of course not – the latter just has more actor a**. Because, they stopped trying to compete for entertainment eyeballs based on the value of ideas, and replaced that with shock and transgression. Matt and Trey got it right in their send-up of the networks in the South Park episode – creativity is hard, so they’ll keep pushing lines instead of coming up with new ideas(look for the new sitcom “Debby does Doggies”, on your local CBS affiliate soon).
    If you look at the context in the constitution, freedom of speech comes just after freedom of religion and just before freedom of the press, the right to assemble, and to petition the government. The entire “free speech means I can do whatever I want, whenever I want, wherever i want in public” doesn’t hold water: it was and is _very_ important to allow dissent and the expression of ideas requires that.
    But, Janet Jackson’s right breast is not an idea. Exposing it in on national television is not speech. While this incident can be seen as moderately harmless to adults in our porn-drenched society, it is _not_ at all clear that that such casual disregard for standards of conduct should be tolerated. It sets an inappropriate example to those less insulated (children) using public airwaves. If you want to do send that message, just do it on cable is what we’re saying. That’s what it’s there for.
    Equating ‘freedom of speech’ to ‘freedom of expression’ is, was, and always will be a bogus one – it’s one of those false rights that really just serves the agenda of the left – that is, the end of universal standards and social values. Nothing more.

  3. tim wg Avatar

    If you really want freedom of speech in broadcasting, you can start with the courts by allowing some conservative judges and getting some balance in the mainstream media and schools/colleges/universities. Then get the ACLU off our backs.
    The FCC needs a new mandate. This issue is not one of Republicans, but also of Democrats as well.

  4. Matthew Goggins Avatar

    JRP,
    I definitely am sympathetic to your arguments. I don’t lose a lot of sleep over a big network getting fined for indecency over Janet Jackson’s boob flash.
    But the problem as I see it is not that it’s a bad thing that the government wants to fine broadcasters who are too sleazy.
    The problem is that the government almost always takes a good idea (certain hours of broadcasting should be minimally family-friendly) and ends up implementing and enforcing it in a heavy-handed, arbitrary, and sometimes scary way.
    The problem is not the goal (decency in broadcasting) but the tool (government censorship). A better tool would be consumer feedback. Sensitive, wholesome programming would receive high ratings and happy viewers. Outrageous programming would receive low ratings and/or consumer outrage (which would frighten away certain kinds of advertisers).
    When there were only three major broadcasters and no cable, this free-market approach might not have worked very well without an assist from federal regulation. But with all the competition and market-segmentation we have nowadays, the consumer feedback model seems to be most appropriate.

  5. Bill Avatar

    JRP, South Park is, in my opinion, one of the funniest programs ever produced on television. It’s a show featuring 4th graders who curse constantly. On what station in the ’50s were shows like that programmed? I wasn’t alive then, maybe there were shows like that that I’m not aware of. All I know is you couldn’t pay me to sit through an entire episode of the Honeymooners.
    My sarcastic point is that everyone has an opinion on what is good or not in entertainment. Everyone also has a threshold of offensiveness, and that also varies by person. I don’t know of anyone my age who was offended by Janet Jackson’s breast, and I don’t know of any children who could possibly be harmed by a 1/2 second glimpse of a human being’s breast. Do we need standards? Perhaps. But whose standards? A bunch of middle-aged men in a Washington office who kow-tow to the easily offended that call in every time Desperate Housewives is on? Why is their opinion of what is offensive more important than my own? Especially when the easiest solution is for the easily offended to just turn off the TV.
    Just try to consider this: if South Park were introduced in this current restrictive environment, would the second episode ever make it on the air? Remember, the first ever episode, way back in 1997, was named “Cartman Gets an Anal Probe”.

  6. steven streight aka vaspers the grate Avatar

    I need links to the Inked Finger photos, I want to post Inked Finger photos on my blog.
    DO I Google “inked finger” on Google images?
    Help, please. Urgent. Thanks.