Blogola: One more note

Blogola: One more note

: As I read all the sniping and snarking and bitchslapping among the ex-Deaniac bloggers at each others’ throats, I’m mindful of one thing: If things had gone their way, these people would be running the country now. Yow.

: I keep reading more comments on the various ex-Deaniacs’ blogs and I’ll add this: No wonder they lost Iowa. No wonder Dean screamed.

A lot of fussing and fuming. This is politics, folks. If you can’t stand the heat….

: UPDATE: Zephyr Teachout posts an FAQ on all this, politely. And Glenn Reynolds points to Bigwig’s post on politeness. That is striking about all this: the shrill tone of many. There’s irony in that: You’d think that Kos and MyDD would or could be playing the victims — not of Zephyr’s post now but of what she alleges about the Dean campaign’s motives in paying them. Instead, they and others go on the attack and get downright nasty about it with their former allies. And there seems to be little awareness that this is in public, that people are watching how they — we, as a culture — behave when faced with tough questions, an awareness that everything they say could be quoted tomorrow in the Wall Street Journal or the Washington Post. This is, after all, the transparent medium, isn’t it? Right now, I happen to be watching Das Experiment, the German movie about a scientific experiment simulating a prison. Imagine that this whole blog thing is just one big psychological experiment and the guys in the white coats are watching to see what we lab rats do in this maze of media and politics and life. To paraphrase Ed Koch: How are we doin’?

: I also imagine Republican strategists reading through this grand kerfluffle and laughing their little heads off as they say it’s going to be easy to beat the liberals again because they’re so damned busy beating themselves.

Some folks are going to wake up tomorrow with a mean snark hangover.

: There are, sadly, a few examples of uncivilized responses in the comments to this post. I’ll leave a few of them here, monuments to man’s inhumanity to man. But I won’t tolerate more.

76 responses to “Blogola: One more note”

  1. Evan Avatar

    Yes, but it’s because they act that way that they are indeed not running the country.

  2. Zed Avatar

    I had made my mind up to vote dem. long before Dean showed his face, I still don’t see how he rose to fame, I knew he was a farce, I wasn’t surprised his flame blew out, it had nothing to do with the ‘scream’. He just wasn’t important, period. Perhaps one of the Many mistakes that that jackass Kerry made was jumping on board the Dean wagon. God, I can’t believe I voted for that jackass. But what can ya do? It is just not our time, yet

  3. Tom Watson Avatar

    Jeff – look who IS running the country now. Yow – try criminal.

  4. Hunter McDaniel Avatar
    Hunter McDaniel

    Tom, that kind of hyperbole is another reason why the dems are not running the country. All of the hysteria from Michael Mooore et al. cost your party a lot more votes than you gained.

  5. Jerome Armstrong Avatar

    Jeff, the post directed toward you for response is here:
    Ethical Blogging
    Calling me a bitchslapper isn’t necessarily the correct direction either.

  6. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    Jerome: Yes, I responded to that post. Apparently I responded under the wrong post but that what the target of my response.
    I happened to put these links up randomly associated with those three words, but I’d say the tone of your comments on various sites would fall under my description.

  7. Jesse E. Avatar

    Jeff,
    I think you’re absolutely right about the facts of the Kos/MyDD issue, but that your previous attempts to re-frame it as an “opportunity to define our culture” – while well-intended – are pointless, if not a bit naive. The entire point of this story, from the original WSJ piece through the O’Reilly-Hewitt echo chamber, was to find (or in this case, create) a liberal Armstrong Williams, and thereby obscure the original sin (particularly that of the Bush administration). Its a strategy as old politics itself, and here, it has played out exquisitely well: by Novak, by Fox News, and by conservative bloggers, most of whom have (predictably) eschewed an opportunity for “discussion” for one of partisan business-as-usual. This was their chance to change to the story (and as a bonus, smear the web’s most prominent lefty blogger) and many took it. Why wouldn’t they?
    Indeed, over these last couple days, the only lesson I have learned about blog culture is its growing weakness. One of the things I always loved and respected about that culture (as a avid reader and former writer) was that regardless of political persuasion, bloggers always stood up for one another – a professional ethic the resembles cops more than journalists – and for the integrity of blogging itself. Perhaps that is how it should be, given that blogging raison d’etre is (in my opinion) more about policing objectivity than objectivity itself (unlike journalists, bloggers wear their political biases on their sleeve – what brings them together is their vocation as watchdogs, not ideologues). Those conservative and centrist bloggers whom I’ve learned to trust as honest and fair have defended their leftist comrades Kos and MyDD from this bogus attack (among them Andrew Sullivan, Ed Cone, and to a less satisfying degree, Instapundit). But watching Hugh Hewitt – often held up as the blogger’s paradigm – completely distort this story – and in the process, call into question the ethics of Devin Drum, TPM, and other bloggers on the left (see his most recent update) – simply to satisfy his partisan mandate has been downright sad. Indeed, if at the end of this whole bruhaha, one blogger become an example of something, I hope it is Hewitt, not Kos. For it is the latter who has chosen parisian solidarity over that of his fellow bloggers, and through his transgression, made clear one of the blogosphere’s most constitutive cultural/ethical expectations.

  8. Bizarro Jarvis Avatar
    Bizarro Jarvis

    So, your point was that it was about how blogs could be used, but – wait – it’s really about fanning the flames of an untrue rumor.
    Really Jeff, this is low even for you.

  9. oodja Avatar

    Tom, that kind of hyperbole is another reason why the dems are not running the country. All of the hysteria from Michael Mooore et al. cost your party a lot more votes than you gained.
    Bah. Give me one concrete instance of Michael Moore costing the Dems a vote. He has become the scapegoat of a liberal leadership that completely and utterly failed to articulate a competing vision to Bush’s “War On Terra”. At least Moore had the balls to challenge the President, whereas Kerry opted for a milquetoast “Me, Too” platform that left even the bluest of blue states wishing we’d nominated someone else as candidate. You don’t win diddly squat by agreeing with your opponent – given that option B was voting for a guy who claimed he also didn’t have a problem with invading Iraq, is it any surprise that Americans decided not to change horses in midstream?

  10. Rogers Cadenhead Avatar

    It is politics, Jeff, and we’ve all learned the Dukakis doctrine: If you ignore scurrilous and irresponsible attacks in the belief they’ll go away, you’re going to get beaten like a drum.
    Teachout made the recklessly false statement that the bloggers were “explicitly” (her word) paid to give Dean good press. She’s a former attorney. What did she think would come as a consequence of that statement, which she now admits to being false?

  11. Jesse E. Avatar

    At the end of my comment above, I meant to say that it was the former (Hewitt) not the latter (Kos) who has chosen partisan solidarity. sorry for the mistake.

  12. Zed Avatar

    The truth is there isn’t a blogger that wouldn’t sell his/her kidney for a few bucks, if any blogger tells you he/she wouldn’t sell out, they are lying. They are infact, Instalying

  13. Zed Avatar

    besides, Dean says nothing about the potential for the Democratic party, any Dean rhetoric is just hitting below the belt, Really jeff, you do sink low at times.

  14. hmm Avatar

    Maybe Zell Miller could challenge them to a duel? Ah yes the Bush Administration and their supporters — paradigms of maturity.

  15. Bizarro Jarvis Avatar
    Bizarro Jarvis

    Jeff Jarvis, the blogosphere’s Dan Rather in waiting.

  16. Jerome Armstrong Avatar

    Jeff, you did not respond, you avoided the issue. Look, I asked you to respond to the ethical question regarding Zephyr Teachout. Your non-response just shows she has your head up her….

  17. Dave Weigel Avatar
    Dave Weigel

    I have zero love for the Dean folks, but I consider three things.
    – They’re being slandered. Manifestly untrue things and easily rebutted allegations (did Chris Suellentrop CONSIDER a phone call to Kos before accusing him of secretly consulting for his site’s sponsered candidates?) are being tossed at them.
    – They’ve learned the lessons of the Swift Boat affair. When your opponent comes at you with a knife, you come at him with a gun. Not an invisibility cloak. Those things don’t work.
    – They’re human. They’re defending a friend’s honor and they’re pissed off about it. So they can’t be angry? The worst post in this whole affair PALES compared to an average discussion at Little Green Footballs.

  18. Bizarro Jarvis Avatar
    Bizarro Jarvis

    For all JJ’s talk about ethics and the great awakening of the blogosphere, it’s hilarious to see
    1) pile on a patently false report without even bothering to verify it
    2) back peddle in pretty hilarious display of ass covering and semantic parsing
    3) when that doesn’t work, start throwing mud and start hitting the Dean crowd below the belt
    4) refuse to even respond to Armstrong in an attempt to just ignore it all and hope it blows over before the big ethical disaster known as the “Blogging, Journalism and Credibility” conference
    This is simply too sweet.
    It’s like a miracle play.

  19. Kat Avatar

    Sure, when your bud, Kos, said Screw them, when referring to Americans mutilated by muslim barbarians, that is no biggie, it’s just anti American A-holes like Kos and his leper colony celebrating. I constantly wonder why that waste of skin continues to pollute this country with his hatred. You only bring LGF into this discussion because they aren’t pro-terrorist as some are.

  20. Oliver Avatar

    What an assholey thing to post, Jeff. The GOP is losing the war on terror and you’re extrapolating a blogger snit to be a template for how Dean would lead. Because he was right about Iraq, and you weren’t. Again.

  21. Miguel Avatar

    Congratulations for the Instalanche! Great blog you have here. Keep up the good work! ;-)

  22. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    Oliver: Dean couldn’t even win Iowa. I now have a clearer sense why. And again, I don’t want him to lead the Democratic party. Sorry if you don’t like that opinion. But, hey, it’s politics. It’s democracy. If you can’t stand the choice…

  23. felixrayman Avatar
    felixrayman

    Jeff, do you really not see the hypocrisy in the way you have treated this story while at the same time going on and on about Dan Rather?
    You’ve committed every error CBS committed and far more, and you show far less ability to stop and find out what went wrong. You were, unwittingly or not, part of a smear job on these people and you seem to think it’s no big deal. Your integrity is pretty much trashed at this point.
    What exactly did Dan Rather and CBS do wrong? Now look in the mirror, old man. If you don’t like something, don’t you do it too, OK?

  24. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    By the way, Oliver, even Joe Trippi won’t support your man, Dean. What does that tell you? What are you saying to him on his blog?

  25. Jerome Armstrong Avatar

    LOL, you call me a bitchslapper in your post and it’s linked to by the rightwingers as an example of the uncivilized responses from the partisan democratic bloggers.
    Ah well…. I guess given those whole projection of unethical behavior by the unethical one in question and the avoidance thereof by the ethical brigade all set for their conference together on bloggers credibility, it’s to be expected.

  26. Jeff Jarvis Avatar

    Well, Jerome, you could look at it another way: as an effort to stop the bitchslapping by calling it out. Look at the comment you left here and tell me you’re not being abusive and uncivilized. Very political of you.

  27. Dishman Avatar

    I’d like to see the Republicans win in ’06..
    At the same time, I’d like to see at leads 40 Democrats in the Senate (plus Jeffords, 41 without), and at least 190 in the House.
    Please, chill out.

  28. Jason Puckett Avatar
    Jason Puckett

    Yeah, really. Their snarkiness is really uncalled for. Uncalled for when Robert Novak lies about them on CNN. Uncalled for after Bill O’Reilly lies about their careers on his #1 news show on cable, with a one-sided response from Hugh Hewitt. Uncalled for when Slate calls for Markos to be “hanged.”
    Jeez, Jeff. Snarkiness is probably the best response. I’d probably want to punch someone in the face!

  29. felixrayman Avatar
    felixrayman

    Look at the comment you left here and tell me you’re not being abusive and uncivilized
    If you would take the smallest effort to fact-check what you write before posting it, the people you write about just might be less abusive and more civilized. If, after posting something that turned out to be false or misleading you took responsibility for it and issued a retraction and apology, the people you write about might be less abusive and more civilized.
    Come on. Browse through your site and look at some of the things you wrote about Dan Rather and Memogate and take some time to think about them.

  30. dries Avatar

    must be a full moon, since moonbats are swarming tonight. wonder how they manage to fly with unevenly sized wings – over-developed left & rudimentary right ones. must be an endless flight in circles.

  31. dries Avatar

    must be a full moon, since moonbats are swarming tonight. wonder how they manage to fly with unevenly sized wings – over-developed left & rudimentary right ones. must be an endless flight in circles.

  32. dries Avatar

    must be a full moon, since moonbats are swarming tonight. wonder how they manage to fly with unevenly sized wings – over-developed left & rudimentary right ones. must be an endless flight in circles.

  33. bob Avatar

    Jeff,
    You have a clearcase of two people gratuitously smeared, and who have you rushed to the defense of? The smearer. What a hero you are.
    The world knows that you are chief bitchslapper of the blogosphere. Snark, pettiness, blog whoring, that’s you Jeff. Never let a fact get in the way of your self promotion. That’s been your MO for the two years I’ve been reading you.
    What’s sad, is that evidently it’s working. Scum attracts scum, and you are getting on TV more and more.
    Congratulations,

  34. Jeff's Conscience Avatar
    Jeff’s Conscience

    Poor Jeff. I have a lot of sympathy for you after you called Juan Cole “pondscum.”
    You were wrong about Iraq.
    Dean was right.
    Get over it.
    How come you never talk about Iraq anymore, by the way? And the fact is you are using this “non-story” to plug that “conference” you are having with your right-wing friends that you are an apologist for.
    Get over yourself.
    You are an insult to Stern-fans all over the place.
    P.S. I ain’t taking your f—ing pledge.

  35. Karl Rove Avatar
    Karl Rove

    Bwa ha ha ha ha ha ha!
    And thanks!

  36. Instahack Avatar
    Instahack

    Jeff, Jerome did not leave any impolite comment here, but I will: go f**k yourself. And you didn’t respond to Jerome at all.

  37. Dishman Avatar

    Come over to “the Dark Side”, Jeff.

  38. Oliver Avatar

    No, Dean didn’t win Iowa. But he also doesn’t play suck-up with the right. And yes, Jeff, he was right about Iraq and you weren’t. When hacks like Glenn Reynolds are applauding what you’re saying, perhaps you should consider the company you keep. I don’t post comments on Trippi’s blog cause he doesn’t really blog. Then again, Trippi doesn’t make a habit as a Democrat of being anti-Democrat. I’m sure you and Mickey Kaus have much to chat about as well.

  39. Carrick Talmadge Avatar
    Carrick Talmadge

    My own take is that Jerome Armstrong did nothing wrong, but Kos did step over the line. Like most people, I don’t think Kos’s situation is comparable to Armstrong Williams, but once you accept money from someone, they become your customer. In Kos’s case, his accepting payment from the Dean campaign created a conflict of interest between serving the Deaniacs and providing a service to the Kossaks (also paid via web ads).
    I suppose you can take the viewpoint that “conflicts of interest are to be managed, not avoided.” I’m fine with this in business. I’m not sure it makes sense though when discussing journalistic ethics.

  40. Ash Poop'Em Avatar
    Ash Poop’Em

    Oliver, are you mad because you lost all your best Pokemon cards in a desperate battle against an 8-year-old?

  41. Geek, Esq. Avatar

    Wow, this amounts to a classic defense of trolling and lying.
    “How dare you get so upset when someone smears you in public? Have some civility, sir. Being falsely labeled a shill and a whore in the media is no reason to lose your temper.”
    Funny how you didn’t make this kind of argument when the Armstrong Williams thing broke. After all, that side did win and they’re the ones involved in a real ethical scandal (I guess we just add it to their tab). I guess you prefer corruption and sleaze to uncomfortable straight talk. Well, as the saying goes, every democracy gets the leader they deserve . . .
    And why aren’t you so upset with a brazen liar like Hugh Hewitt? I know, calling a liar a “liar” is uncivil, the truth be damned.
    It would be refreshing to see you, for once, actually take a stand against some Republicans. It’s what one normally expects out of Democrats.

  42. Jim Treacher Avatar

    I suggested payURLa for the phenomenon, but then somebody else came up with clickbacks. I think I like that one best.
    “My blogola has a first name, it’s D-A-I-L-Y, my blogola has a second name, it’s K-O-S…”

  43. Brian Avatar

    dreis: must be an endless flight in circles.
    It is. It most assuredly is.
    Funny how these “raise the tone” posts always turn into biker brawls.

  44. Mr. Bowen Avatar

    Poor little Oliver. What’s the matter, little girl? Is the big bad InstaDaddy not giving you that sweet linkage you crave so much? Could it be that he’s tired of you throwing fits and has finally decided to disassociate himself from your immature self? Can you really blame him?
    The Left is out of touch with reality, out of touch with Americans, and out of power for the next 70 years.
    Deal with it.

  45. carsonfire Avatar

    Bah, looks like DemocratUnderground’s spilled over into JJ’s comments.
    Funny how Karl Rove is now controlling even Zephyr Teachout… even if it is to save Armstrong Williams’ hide, you’d think KKKarl would be taking a little “me” time after the election.
    I must have missed my last couple of VRWC newsletters.

  46. Geek, Esq. Avatar

    And Mr. Treacher adds to the rampant dishonesty.
    What’s a word that combines “Republican” and “liar?”

  47. Far North Avatar
    Far North

    “If things had gone their way, they would be running the country”.
    And maybe “they” would have caught bin Laden, not wrecked the economy by bankcrupting the treasury, recognized that as the third year of US occupation approaches, maybe this whole Iraq this ain’t going so well after all. Maybe “they” wouldn’t have stretched the military so thin (fighting a crackpot war). Maybe “they” would have been prepared to respond to legitimate threats to our country in the future. Maybe “they” would realize that inventing a crisis, like Bush did with Iraq, is no way to discuss Social Security. Maybe “they” would understand the importance of working with our allies around the world to confront the problems of the the 21st century. Maybe “they” would have the ability to learn from their mistakes.
    No maybe about it, “they” would have chased Osama bin Laden to the 4 corners of the earth and hunted him down. But not your President Bush. “Tough” talk is all you low standard conservatives ever demand from this disaster of a president. Results? Naw just tough talk.
    “They” most certainly would not have been the greatest serial liar in the history of American politics.
    Remember, nothing is more stunning in politics than the hypocrisy of the new century conservativ.

  48. Jim Treacher Avatar

    “And Mr. Treacher adds to the rampant dishonesty.”
    Is it not spelled “K-O-S”?

  49. Tim Karr Avatar

    I’ve never seen so much self-conscious hand wringing over a non-issue. The whole Dean-blogger payola story was yet another example of false equivalence or “lazy equivalence” as Gillmor dubbs it — as conservatives attempted to deflect criticism over Armstrong Williams payola by planting a story about up an alleged ethical lapse from the opposing camp. Jeff is right: it is sad to see this non-issue catch fire in the blogosphere in this way. What’s wrong with you people? The real issue here is taxpayer money being used to buy favorable press. Imagine if you left bloggers were to use your energies and collective audience to investigate other instances of federal payola. Remember how effectively right Bloggers mobilized behind the Rather memo. You could be doing the same, bringing to light other cases of Gov’t payola. Instead you get caught up in a pissing match over an issue that really doesn’t matter. Jerome, Zephyr, you

  50. Geek, Esq. Avatar

    Actually, it’s spelled: L-A-U-C-K.
    You see, Mr. Treacher, the only ones so far accepting under the table payments for blogging have been people on your own side. Just like Armstrong Williams.
    But, go ahead and continue to spread lies. You and Hewitt and Johnson can hold hands at the next “Liars for Bush” parade.

  51. Jim Treacher Avatar

    I thought it was short for “Markos,” but I stand corrected.

  52. Geek, Esq. Avatar

    Sigh. I’ll take the lame attempt at humor as a sign of retreat, and an acknowledgement that there has been no payola-for-blogging between DFA and Jerome/Kos.
    But, to answer your question, your blogola/payurla is spelled “L-A-U-C-K.”

  53. Jim Treacher Avatar

    Good to know! Have a nice one.

  54. Geek, Esq. Avatar

    And you as well.
    P.S. Avoid insomnia, it’s a bitch. As am I right now.

  55. The Church Secretary Avatar

    So let me get this straight:
    Right-wing pundits can spout and repeat all the lies, slander, and vitriol they want, but as long as they remain in lock-step it is not worth mentioning. If left-wing pundits happen to publicly air disagreements among themselves (imagine that happening in a democracy!), then it gets gleefully bandied about as a fatal flaw.
    Held to this standard, political success can only mean nazism.

  56. Ed Poinsett Avatar
    Ed Poinsett

    Yes, but it’s because they act that way that they are indeed not running the country.
    Jeff, just reading the comments of your Leftie fans here demonstrates how true this is and will continue to be.

  57. big dirigible Avatar
    big dirigible

    “Some folks are going to wake up tomorrow with a mean snark hangover.”
    No, they show no sign of waking up. That’s the real problem here. I particularly like Jesse E.’s take – a bunch of petulant children taunt each other with the intellectual equivalent of “nyah, your candidate wears army boots,” and somehow it’s all a conservative plot. Sound asleep, and looking likely to stay that way.
    I was unimpressed with Dean before, but based on the company he keeps (or tried to buy), I’m starting to realize that maybe I’d been giving him too much credit.

  58. RW Avatar

    Good post, Jeff.
    The maturity level among many is deplorable. Type anything worthwhile and an immature blogger will respond with “but you support Bush” or “Bush is worse” or the like.
    Then, they’ll call you stupid.
    Right before they are unable to convince anyone to vote for them.
    The left is killing the Democratic party and the lefties doing it think that they’re losing because they aren’t mean enough.

  59. p.lukasiak Avatar

    Really Jeff, this is low even for you.
    you don’t read much of Jarvis’ output, do you?
    The real story is not the “back biting” and “bitch-slapping” going on among a few dozen people on the internet—its the way that the right-wing hate machine went into overdrive on a story that even Jarvis acknowledges is bogus.
    But all that Jarvis sees is the defense of the honor of two people who have made an extraordinary contribution (not just politically, but technologically as well) to the on-line community.
    I mean, this is a little much coming from the creator of “Entertainment Weekly” — in other words, Jarvis made a living (and helped degrade the environment in which journalist takes place) by exploiting the very kind of “sniping” going with “Zephyrgate”.
    Instead of asking “How did this bogus story get in the Wall Street Journal, and how did it then jump so quickly to become a major topic on the cable shoutfests”, he first tries to ignore the SCANDALOUS WSJ reporting and focus on the ‘ethical’ issues involved (as if he has the first clue about ethics) and now decries the ‘snarkfest’ going on in the snarkiest way imaginable.
    Jarvis, where the fuck is your demand for an immediate, full scale investigation of the Wall Street Journal on this story? When are you going to start writing thousands upon thousands of words on the sloppy journalism and obvious bias of FoxNews.
    That is the difference between the “liberal media” and people like Jarvis and his fellow travelers. The actual “liberal” media (not the so-called liberal media) is self correcting. Jarvis and his friends find a lie, and exploit it to the hilt.

  60. Andrea Harris Avatar

    Jim: I liked “trackbucks” myself.
    Geek, Esq.: Republiar? Repliar? Liarblican? Just trying to help.

  61. kat Avatar

    Screw “Screw them” Moulitas, all of the candidates endorsed by him(from whom he likely received big bucks) lost their elections. He did us a favor. The rightwing doesn’t hate Kos–we pity him.

  62. tim wg Avatar

    I have one thing to ask, “Is This News?”
    I imagined Democratic unity during the last election, but it was an illusion. They only lived with each other to elect Kerry, yet they were never united.
    Deaniacs are doing what they do best… The Dean Scream!!!

  63. ushie Avatar

    Refiblican?
    And I’m still laughing over the image of Dean and the rest tracking bin Laden down to the four corners of the earth. That and the one about begging our allies to wuv us again. Yeah, the French never took no money from Saddam. I miss them so.

  64. carsonfire Avatar

    Heh… “trackbucks”…
    Seriously, though, when’s somebody going to tell the angry mob here that this story would be dead already if it weren’t for them? I mean, JJ does, indirectly when he says: “…it’s going to be easy to beat the liberals again because they’re so damned busy beating themselves.” Is there anyone that they trust who can tell them straight out? Or will any leftist icon that starts talking sensibly to them be immediately branded yet another Zephyr-like traitor? They can’t even allow a sensible left-moderate like JJ to have an independent opinion.
    There wasn’t much defense of Armstrong Williams because he got himself into his own ethical quagmire, and quickly acknowledged and apologized for it… similarly, I haven’t really read that much about this Dean situation that sounds like an attack: commentators merely note that it has happened, and the left blows its collective top and keeps what otherwise is a non-issue alive as a story for much longer than it would have been, otherwise. The story becomes, not the original payment, but the reaction to the story by players like Kos, who, being inherently wacky, are compelled to say things like “f*ck ethics”. Many commenters in this thread have been not much better as spokesmen for their position.
    And they just can’t stop themselves. They’ve become too easy to tweak. They don’t realize that it’s not “KKKarl Rove” manipulating them from behind the scenes. They’re being manipulated out in the open by an endless army of Jim Treachers who makes them see red by baiting them with little “Blogola” songs.

  65. Jim Treacher Avatar

    Or how about The Knack? “Dun-dun DIH-DIH dun-DIH, dun-DIH, dun-dun-DIH dun-dun-dun-DIH-DIH, dun-DIH… MY blogola! Ooooh my little greasy one, my sleazy one, Dean paid for the use of your TIME, blogola!” Etc.

  66. Zed Avatar

    Jeff,
    This is why I don’t have comments on my blog, I really don’t need and don’t want to know what kind of idiots are reading me, I perfer to be in my own fantasy land, thinking those reading me are atleast as smart or smarter than me.
    You don’t seem to be getting that much luck, atleast I can pretend.

  67. thibaud Avatar

    This discussion, such as it is, illustrates perfectly why the vast majority of intelligent Americans still consider the blogosphere to be a source of noise, nastiness and juvenile slanging rather than informed analysis and debate.
    Folks, whatever your persuasion, try sticking to facts, logic, and above all, politeness. Otherwise the blogosphere is likely to remain the political version of dungeons ‘n’ dragons. Pity, that. It could be so much more.

  68. ushie Avatar

    Been a registered Democrat (and still am) since I realized that being an Independent meant I couldn’t vote in primaries. Anyway, so many in the Dem party seem to feel “My party, right or wrong,” and that’s just idiotic.
    No one in the party seems to wish to evince the slightest common sense, or to take to task the crazy and insensitive nuts who’ve taken over. I mean, Good God, when Teresa said, “Let them go naked,” why the hell didn’t Dems remember theirs used to be the party of human dignity? Why didn’t anyone in charge say, “Hey, she’s off her meds again, we’re getting the Hollywood crowd to donate their extra clothes so the hurricane people can grab on to some dignity in their suffering?”
    And, by all that’s holy, why didn’t anyone take Al Sharpton aside and say, “Hey, Al, sure, you can speak at the convention, but your very existence pisses a lot of people off. That whole Tawana Brawley thing, fer instance. For the good of the party, don’t run. Don’t turn the Dem primaries into a clown show.”
    And for God’s sake, John Kerry? How could I vote for a fucking traitor? I knew someone who was a POW, and his life got even worse after Kerry slandered his fellow soldiers in those halcyon winter soldier days.
    I mean, where is the legitimate criticism? Is every act of lunacy on the part of the extreme not to be criticized for fear it will look like weakness? What happened to my party, the party of self-examination, moral courage, and dignity?
    Any Dems out there who think Kennedy would have pussied around with the French? Would have gone to Cuba to hang with Castro? Would have exulted over the deaths of American soldiers? I’m thinking not, but I bet someone will call me a RWDB for what I’ve just written.

  69. lambert strether Avatar

    Shrill, eh?
    Nice to see all the DLC types here! I knew they had to be somewhere!

  70. Eric Deamer Avatar

    Who are these people? Where do they come from? Do they have friends, families, jobs etc.? It’s mind-boggling.

  71. Ernest Brown Avatar

    Ushie,
    That’s just it, the “right” has never bought into the stupidity of “no enemies on the right.” Ever since Buckley gave the Birchers the boot in the late 50’s, they’ve been more than willing to boost the idiot fringe over the side when they needed to.
    The whining we are seeing here is an example of permissive parenting. Their moms apparently never used the old matriarchal example of the tu quoque fallacy, “If Armstrong Williams jumped off a bridge…”

  72. Eileen Avatar

    And ushie, as a registered lib who typically votes repub in national elections, I want to say you do your party proud. If people like you were leading the dems, I doubt Jeff would find himself imagining repub strategists laughing. Kudos to you for your fine, fair and rational views. You don’t sound like a RWDB Or a LWDB. Just sane.

  73. Mr. Bowen Avatar

    “What’s a word that combines “Republican” and “liar?””
    “Democrat”?

  74. carsonfire Avatar

    You know, the problem with the Democratic party goes even beyond merely accepting and pandering to the fringe; they’ve gone far beyond that and now routinely marginalize (what’s left of) their mainstream.
    Ushie represents the real reality-based community within the Democratic party. Guys like him get slaughtered on Democratic forums… they are ‘Republican Lite’ or ‘DLC’ if they dare challenge the party orthodoxy. And he is ignored by the national leaders, who are frightened and cowed by the extremists.
    A valid comparison would be if a legion of David Dukes were not just allowed in the Republican party, but controlled all of the major party megaphones. David Duke making slanderous anti-Democrat movies; David Duke running right-wing forums and 527s; David Duke accusing other Republicans of being ‘Democrat Lite’; David Duke writing hundreds of blogs that require copious amounts of vulgarity and colorful epithets to mask the habitual failures in logic and reason; David Duke organizing self-destructive crap like ‘Not a Damn Dime Day’, which risks making the party look foolish if a failure, and bizarrely punishing all the wrong people if successful. And, for all that effort, David Duke being lauded and visibly pandered to by the national party leaders.
    I think this is why Ushie and other Democrats before him feel frustrated and disenfranchised. The Democratic fringe is correct about one thing: their national leaders do tend to be spineless (their word, not mine); not because they don’t have the guts to be sufficiently loud, crude, and obnoxious in public, but because they don’t have the courage to shut *them* out.
    I know this is only marginally on topic, now. *Stretches it back*… Kos strikes me as being one of those ‘David Dukes’ on the left. Why should I care if he took money from the Dean camp, disclosure or no disclosure?
    The fact that he’s taken so seriously by the Democratic party is the real scandal.

  75. ushie Avatar

    Thanks for the kind words, guys.
    My feeling about ahem, the Dem lunatic fringe that’s running my party straight into the sewer? Bobby Kennedy wouldn’t have lowered himself to wipe his ass with them.

  76. Ken Pierce Avatar
    Ken Pierce

    As a long-time plague-on-both-your-parties independent who’s looking forward to moving to Kazakhstan but would still like to feel like there was a moderately functional society left in the Old Country…
    I read the Kos, because I want to get the perspective of the extreme left, though I think they’re pretty nutty. I read Rush Limbaugh, because I want to get the perspective of the arrogant, self-satisfied far right. (Though I have to agree with carson that in order to get as far right as DailyKos is left, you’d have to be getting into David Duke territory. But that’s Ernest Brown’s excellent point: David Duke gets kicked out of the Republican Party; DailyKos more or less runs the Democratic Party.)
    The Republicans are so obviously a poor choice that they ought to be trivially easy to beat. But — something that the Arab terrorists have never figured out — hate makes you stupid. And despite the desperation with which Democrats assure themselves that Republicans are the party of hatred, as a person on the outside looking in, I don’t think there’s even a contest: the Republicans simply can’t compete in the hatred department. They’re good at snobby patronisation; they’re good at hypocricy; they’re good at ethical, um, compromise. But if you want people who spend at least half their time drooling vitriol, and yet are considered mainstream in their own party, the Democratic stable has the Democratic slate hopelessly outnumbered, even if (as one should) you let one Ann Coulter count for two Molly Ivenses. (Twice as vicious, but I regret to admit, twice as witty; so count ‘er double. Though Molly’s gotten some great lines off in her time.)
    I doubt many of you far-left Democrats will take this as it is meant, which is to say, as reasonably friendly advice from somebody who devoutly wants to have a better alternative to the Republican candidate than he had last time. But if you can’t write about Bush without an eye-twitch that would make Herbert Lom jealous, then you’re not gonna beat him. Because hate makes you stupid. And what has distracted the blogosphere from Armstrong Williams (which is a detestable scandal) is not so much the WSJ’s coverage (which I didn’t even see) as the unbelievable viciousness with which you have turned on one of your own.
    Understand, it doesn’t bother me that you are criticizing Zephyr. It doesn’t even bother me if you do so with an occasional colorful word (e.g., “bitchslapping”). But my God, if you had nuclear weapons, she’d be dead and half the country with her. I’m glad to see that some of you people are saying firmly but calmly, “I think that was a foolish post and it has done a lot of damage,” with which I personally tend to agree. But a bunch of you are saying that she’s a Republican plant, saying things like, “I relish the day when the denizens of hell are gnawing at your filthy carcasses”…my God.
    I don’t think “bitchslapping” was accurate. I think Jeff was downplaying what’s going on, using unduly colorless language…
    You will not win without the middle-of-the-road voter, and you will not win us by behaving like six-year-old children who have been raised by rude Frenchmen.
    But then it’s been a long time since you’ve done anything but lose, and your answer seems to be to do all the things that haven’t worked but amp them up more. Good luck to ya, but if you were a horse I’d give you better odds at the glue factory than the big wreath. Fix it, or, in a consummation certainly not to be wished, I get four MORE years of whoever the elephants put up in 2008. (I won’t even make the obvious jackass joke.)