More than a tragedy — a scandal

This terrible tragedy has now become a scandal.

Aaron Brown just asked a correspondent whether he thought he’d ever stand on the soil of the United States of America and report what he is reporting from New Orleans.

Through a lack of quick action and resources and any semblance of planning, the people left in New Orleans have been condemned to thirst, hunger, filth, disease, fear, crime, danger, and in too many cases death.

The convention center in New Orleans is a symbol of shame. How can we not figure out how to get water there? Babies are starving. People are dying. There is no authority; police have pulled back to defend their own stations or, according to CNN, deserted their posts.

Authorities — from Bush down to cabinet officials down to legislators down to state officials down to the soon-to-be-former-mayor down to those police — have failed these people. No one would argue that this was going to be smooth or easy. But the basics — water, food, safety, goals — are abandoned.

Political careers at every level will end because of this failure.

That is to say nothing of the storm’s terrible toll or the economic crisis that is building. This is about the failure of authority and thus civilization in the heart of New Orleans. This is a scandal.

: LATER: Angelos adds in the comments: “This is America, and this is the best we could do.”

  • Angelos

    That’s it in a nutshell Jeff.

    This is America, and this is the best we could do.

  • Angelos

    And there are rich white people stuck too.

    And that’s NOT snark.

    I know, I know, hard to believ, coming from me.

    But read the interveiw with the tourist lady at the Ritz.

    Scary enough, that the RITZ is out of food.

    But then get to the second interview. The hotel arranged for buses for its guests. Cost, $25000, or $45 per person. People lined up, waiting for their buses to come.

    What happens? The FEDS COMMANDEER THE BUSES!!!!!!

    Yes, all of you wingers who want to blame the people still in the city. Even people with money, after their flights were cancelled, and after the government stole their transportation, can’t get the hell out.

    America. For shame.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    I don’t know, Jeff. Bush declared a disaster before the hurricane even landed. FEMA and Homeland Security staged supplies nearby beforehand. The Governor called out the National Guard and had them in the Superdome. The Navy had ships on the way before the storm cleared the Gulf. And the levee that failed was one that had already been upgraded.

    Having the amount of aid that’s on its way in ther 48 hours since the levee failed is pretty spectacular; it hasn’t been slow by comparison even with recent disasters — and you might want to read up on the Galveston hurricane for more on what used to happen.

    Were there failings? You bet: NO should have had a better evacuation plan, and instead of stopping the looters, the NO police were looting themselves. It seems a little much to blame anyone outside of New Orleans for those issues, though.

    I know it’s the natural impulse to say Someone Should Have Done Something, but sometimes it’s just bigger than we are.

  • Gray

    ‘Political careers at every level will end because of this failure.’
    Hehehe! Gr8 joke!

    Almost every gross failure in the Bush administration has been punished with promotion. Being such a savvy consultant and all, you surely know that.

  • John

    In Houston they are turning away the local variety of homeless people from the Astrodome. They are actually checking ID’s and verifying that you came from New Orleans (or the affected area). I guess compassion isn’t nescessary for the poor souls we see every day.

  • Gray

    ‘And there are rich white people stuck too.’
    Yes. For example one presumably rich owner of a dynamic internet service and his dedicated team: http://www.directnic.com

    Gr8 people. I was I was there…

  • Bob

    I have been following this, and this is the first time I have left a note, so let me just say that no matter how much planning, how much work is done prior to the event, there is no way anyone can plan for this.

    Think of the scope… we are not talking about a city, or even a metro area, we are talking about 300 miles of area that is gone.

    Yes, there is much that could be done, but lets not pile on politicians just yet. What is not getting reported, and I guess because these people are all too busy getting stuff done, is just how much work, relief, lives saved, and hundreds of thousands of people all working 20 hour days doing the best they can.

    So Jeff, with all respect, are you saying that the government should have at its disposal over 100,000 people, equipment, and millions of tons of supplies, not to mention all the transportation, and heavy equipment needed to move it, and clear the roads as they go, standing by and ready to move a moments notice? Would you be willing to pay for it?

    Think about this, at this time from all over the south, trucks, equipment, supplies and personal are all moving in that direction. But in order to help they have to “build” their own support system as they go. It is exactly like dropping 200,000 people in the middle of the Amazon and then expecting the government to move and save them all in 48 hours. Just like on TV.

    It the real world it doesn’t happen.

    Do not fall prey to the media hype of doom, disaster, chaos and death. Theirs is one point of view, and ratings are the Holy Grail. And death sells.

    It is bad… but think about what has been destroyed, and think about how large of an area that covers… then lets see in a few days the level of response.

    I would rather you point out what is being done right, and stories of success and what is going on that is good, then pile on with the other media whores.

    Bob

  • Gray

    Worse yet, John, there has been a report that they turn away refugees who made the ‘mistake’ to come in their car and not to depend on the busses. Incredible.

  • Angelos

    John, you’re serious aren’t you…

  • http://dawnofnewamerica.blogspot.com/ marie

    I watched that too. I am in shock. Where is the help? Veterans For Peace are on their way to New Orleans. We need more groups to mobilize RIGHT NOW and go.

    And yes, BOB, Americans pay taxes so that this kind of situation never happens. I cannot believe this is our country. The government should have been mobilized and ready to go on MONDAY!

    For some reason I feel like I’m in the middle of Mad Max and the Thunder Dome……..only this time it’s the New Orleans Super Dome.

    We are extremely vulnerable right now as a nation. Bush simply isn’t up to snuff.

  • Angelos

    Robert Siegel: We are hearing from our reporter, he’s on another line right now, thousands of people at the convention center in New Orleans with no food, zero.

    Chertoff: As I said, I’m telling you we are getting food and water to areas where people are staging. The one about an episode like this is if you talk to someone or you get a rumor or an anecdotal version of something I think it’s dangerous to extrapolate it all over the place.

    [Snip]

    Robert Siegel: But Mr. Secretary when you say we shouldn’t listen to rumors. These are things coming from reporters who have not only covered many many other hurricanes, they’ve covered wars and refugee camps. These aren’t rumors, they are saying there are thousands of people there.

    Chertoff: I would be–I have not heard a report of thousands of people in the convention center who don’t have food and water.

  • Cool Breeze

    This is an email from my sister in Alexandria, La. That peaceful little city was virtually untouched by the storm, but the big storm is now blowing in. She is a paralegal for a law firm in that city and she jotted this note off to me from work today.

    Subject: Planet of the Apes – We are nearing a police state in Alexandria

    We have approximatley 50,000 refugees in town already.

    Now this…..

    Alexandria has received $500,000 to take in about 30,000 refugeess from New Orleans. The first buses arrived this morning. The problem is most of these people are from the 9th ward of N.O., the poorest or poor area of Orleans Parish. They couldn’t afford to leave. That area has the highest crime rate in the metro area. They think NOTHING of stealing, or worse.

    The cities of Pineville/Alex are opening every commercial property that is for sale to house these refugees. They have reopend 2 abandoned housing projects in Alex.

    The husband of one of the girls in my office is an officer with the APD. He has been calling her throughout the morning to report the goings on around town. He advises us that already today there have been 4 carjackings in Pineville and 7 in Alex and there has been a riot at the Pineville Walmart. According to him, a busload of 9th ward refugees was taken to the old Walmart in Pineville this morning. They did not want to be housed at that facility and began rioting. They beat away the emergency personnel that were assiting them and fled the area. They are now running loose over Pineville.

    Just before lunch there was a riot at the Jackson street Red Cross with people breaking out the front glass to get inside. The channel 5 news at lunch today was basically local officials saying these events were just “rumors” and that there have been no such events actually taking place. However, the same events the officials described as “rumors” were being called in periodically, as they were occuring, by my co-worker’s husband. According to him the public officials are just trying to keep the peace and prevent a widespread panick. They are pulling detectives out of the station to ride with the patrol officers.

    The APD was told at roll call this morning to advise their wives and familes as follows:
    Do not to go out after dark.
    Do not carry a purse in public.
    Do not carry more cash than you can afford to have stolen.
    Lock your vehciles and homes at all times
    Leave room in front of your vehcile, when stopped in traffic so you can get your vehicle out should a carjacker approach your vehicle.
    Do not use side streets – stay on main roads whenever possible.
    Do not let your children play outside unattended.

    Just night before last Pop’s dog, Travis, was barking in the early morning hours (2-3 p.m.) Pop had me get up to see what was going on. Naturally, I only looked through the windows and into our own yard. The next morning we learned that our next door and backdoor neighbors’ sheds were broken into. A generator and power washer were stolen from one and a power painter, lawnmower and weedeater from the other.

    We have a large hurricane fence and a very large, very loud, very black guard dog and burgular bars on all the windows and doors. They didn’t get anything from our house. Yet. Robert is going to get our gun from our storage unit before he goes to work. We are parking our car against the door of our storage shed in the backyard with the dog.

    One of the attorneys who works here has a friend in a State building downtown Baton Rouge. She just called to say their building was on lockdown due to rioting.

    On my lunch hour I went past three service stations on Lee Street that had signs out to indicate they had no gas. There are so many people in town now that you can hardly wiggle. What used to take 15 minutes of a lunch hour to accomplish, now takes an entire hour. There is talk (and this probably is a rumor) that we will be rationing gas next week.

    The partners just announced to us that they are sending our runner with a firm check to get pepper spray for all who want it.

    Yall take care.
    We will.

    Love Ya All.

  • http://www.paradox1x.org Karl

    The oil reserves will be opened up. Bush will appear in New Orleans and make a speech.

    A bump in his approval ratings of 10 points.

    Really. Even with this. No one will take responsibility for their actions here.

    No one.

  • james

    Officials say rumors of an outbreak of crime in Alexandria and the surrounding area caused by Hurricane Katrina evacuees from New Orleans are not true.

    “We haven’t had a spike in crime,” Sgt. Clifford Gatlin with the Alexandria Police Department said Thursday. “There have been no carjackings, armed robberies or gangs of armed men wandering the streets.”

    Gatlin added, “There was crime in Alexandria before the evacuees came and there will be crime when they leave.”

  • Gray

    Bob, with all due respect, be realistic.
    ‘Would you be willing to pay for it?’
    You ALREADY pay for it. As I understand it, it’s not only the job of FEMA to prepare plans for such an instance, but also that of homeland security. You believe it’s unavoidable that the US is still unable to evacuate a major city (not even one of the biggest) in case of a terrorist attack with poisonous agents? 4 years after 911? What did they do with all those billions for homeland security???

    ‘But in order to help they have to “build” their own support system as they go. It is exactly like dropping 200,000 people in the middle of the Amazon and then expecting the government to move and save them all in 48 hours.’
    No, they don’t have to. This is not about herding a mindless mass of individuals in the middle of nowhere, this is the US where there’s a gr8 infrastructure of communication and transportation means and lots of miltiary bases. And this is basicaly a military operation. You need to organize command structures and destribution plans for equippment and supplies and you need a strategy. It shouldn’t be worse than training the military for defcon1. You don’t expect the military to behave like some crackpots in the Amazonas for 72 hours after the prez said ‘the shit hit the fan’, no?

    All this should have been prepared years ago. Problem seems to be, FEMA is full of repubs who had to be awarded with a cosy admin job because of their help in the election. They are just not capable of doing emergency management.

  • Off Shore Pundit

    In October 2001, Mark Fischetti wrote an eerily prescient article for Scientific American, titled “Drowning New Orleans”:

    The boxes are stacked eight feet high and line the walls of the large, windowless room. Inside them are new body bags, 10,000 in all. If a big, slow-moving hurricane crossed the Gulf of Mexico on the right track, it would drive a sea surge that would drown New Orleans under 20 feet of water.

    New Orleans is a disaster waiting to happen. The city lies below sea level, in a bowl bordered by levees that fend off Lake Pontchartrain to the north and the Mississippi River to the south and west. And because of a damning confluence of factors, the city is sinking further, putting it at increasing flood risk after even minor storms. The low-lying Mississippi Delta, which buffers the city from the gulf, is also rapidly disappearing. A year from now another 25 to 30 square miles of delta marsh – an area the size of Manhattan – will have vanished. An acre disappears every 24 minutes. Each loss gives a storm surge a clearer path to wash over the delta and pour into the bowl, trapping one million people inside and another million in surrounding communities. Extensive evacuation would be impossible because the surging water would cut off the few escape routes. Scientists at Louisiana State University (L.S.U.), who have modeled hundreds of possible storm tracks on advanced computers, predict that more than 100,000 people could die. The body bags wouldn’t go very far.

  • Gray

    That’s why Louisiana official have been pressing this administration for financing class 5 levees for years, Off Shore. This year, congress even slashed the funding for the preliminary study.

  • Gray

    ‘President Bush, in a searing speech Thursday night touting his administration’s accomplishments and laying out the challenges ahead, fired some of his heaviest ammunition at the Democrat and education establishments: “We are challenging the soft bigotry of low expectations.”’
    I guess Bob is a perfect example for that. Low expectations, indeed. Must be a democrat.

  • Bob

    Gray,

    Thank you for the respect. Yes, we pay for the planning, and for the framework of a system. Not the whole infrastructure including, most importantly, staff with the necessary skills to handle the groundwork. FEMA is a joke, and will always be a joke, but look at their website. They only have 2,500 employees. They do what they can with what they have, not much other then write plans, and look good in their jackets. Military operation? Come on! Those take MONTHS to plan and build logistics. Amateurs study tactics. Professionals study logistics. Now we are all getting a lesson on why.

    And no, there is NOT infrastructure there. Any more, anyway. Bridges, power, roads, and airports all have to be rebuilt in order to be used.

    I am sorry, but you are not being realistic on what can be accomplished in just a few short hours. In a few more days I expect huge changes as the logistics arrive on station. Meaning staff, transportation, power, supplies, and more. And they all have to come from someplace, and most Americans would not be willing to pay for them to sit around waiting for the next 100 year storm.

    Bob

  • Bob

    Gray,

    I guess that respect was short lived…

    you have no idea what I am, nor is this the place for cheep shots.

    B

  • james

    How much did the Alaska senator get for the bridge to the 500 person island in the latest highway bill?

    was it 250 million?

  • Hunter McDaniel

    Jeff, this rescue and recovery effort has been one cl*****f**k after another, but they all go back to one fundamental problem – an almost total destruction of communications infrastructure. The rescuers couldn’t communicate with each other but, even worse, they couldn’t communicate with the populace they are trying to help, who are spread over hundred of square miles. Cellphones don’t work, few people have battery radios (with a multi-day supply of batteries). News comes mostly by rumor, and a lot of it is wrong. That’s why you see people walking miles to meet buses that never came, etc.

    The Superdome was hell, but in the end 99% of those who heeded advice and took shelter there are coming out of it alive; they’re a lot better off than many of their neighbors who stayed home. Looting was less of a problem than some impromptu gangsterism, which is being suppressed now that law enforcement has arrived in force.

    I think there will be a lot of lessons learned out of this disaster, but they won’t come from finger-pointing and unrealistic expectations – this was, after all, as DISASTER.

  • Gray

    Bob, I don’t have to know who you are to conclude that you have surprisingly low expectations on the emergency management of your country. You wrote very elaborate about that. Beside that, you’re probably a perfectly nice guy, k?

  • John

    The HOU Chronicle has a reporter in the Astrodome blogging “under cover” it sounds like. http://blogs.chron.com/domeblog/

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    This is a tragedy of unbelievable scale. However, I recall the first cries after the tsunami was: America is stingy! America is not doing enough! Where is America?

    The answer, of course, is that while America is capable of quite a bit, America is not God. America cannot walk on water. America did act, and act as quickly as possible under the circumstances. It did things nobody else could do. The criticisms subsided, and rightfully so.

    New Orleans wasn’t prepared for this. Not just the levees; it seems as if they had no clear plan for this day when it came. So are we to sit here and lambaste the people of New Orleans for being unprepared, even as they struggle and die, just as some insist on lambasting everyone else within range? I know the answer for many is that New Orleans had no responsibility whatsoever; it was Bush’s fault for not signing on to Kyoto! (Hatred and fantasy trump reality and compassion)

    For once, I’m really ashamed of Jeff Jarvis, for repeating Angelos’ despicable words. Angelos isn’t some freaking conscience, here, this tragedy is his triumph! This is his day! This proves everything nasty he ever said about anybody else is right! He’s doing a victory lap around the death of a city.

    Like the tsunami, this was too big even for a great nation. There is much still to endure, but focus on what still can be done, not find ways to score political battles and play blame games. It may temporarily allow you to vent your anger, but it is, ultimately, an inhuman and grotesque exercise.

    What’s the big news story today, by the way? What can I do? Where can I go to help? No, the big story I see posted all over the internet today is hand wringing over two photos, one labelled “looter” and the other called “finder” — great masses of energy that would be better spent *doing* something is wasted arguing that proof of racism has been found, although the situations described by the photographers/caption writers explicitly differentiate the two events by situation and not race. And I’m sure an Angelos will not even care — blindered by hate, he will barrel right along with his imaginary “proof” that America is wicked.

    The great internet, gateway to the future. And this is how it’s being used. Not to bring missing people together, not to brainstorm ways of finding quicker help to people, but venting angry rants and pointlessly crowing about how lousy America is (just like we knew all along!)

    John and Angelos: the last report I heard about the Astrodome is not that they are simply turning away homeless, they are turning away everyone who is not being bussed from the Superdome, which they are still trying to evacuate.

    To allow the shelter to fill with locals before the evacuations are complete would *not* be compassionate. This is perhaps a good example, though, of how easy it is to blast people who are really responsible for unpleasant decisions. It’s easy to say “let everybody in” when you don’t have the very real responsibility of dealing with the consequences of such a potentially disasterous and inhuman mistake. I have no doubt that a great deal of the decisions having to be made now are not easy choices, but are similarly fraught with negative impacts on all sides.

  • Eileen

    As I was writing below, Jeff was writing above. I repeat:

    The disaster zone is the size of Britain. The numbers keep changing, but we’re talking evacuations of in excess of 75,000 people from the NO area alone to Houston, Dallas and San Antonio via one passable highway, which is also shared by all other emergency vehicles, police, fire, etc.

    The magnitude of this calamity is beyond belief.

    Those here who keep blabbing about what wasn’t done when by Bush et al. are just too tiresome to respond to at this point. I guess they’ve been in on every meeting and telephone call since this was a category one storm crossing the state of FLA.

    I am as anguished as the rest of you to witness the horrific suffering. But I doubt the crowd in NO would have been pleased if only 1,000 had been bused out on Tuesday followed by another 1,000 on Wednesday; i.e., in drips and drabs. Instead, by yesterday, Wednesday, they had mobilized sufficiently to begin continuous evacuations. That’s count em TWO DAYS after the storm stopped wreaking havoc, followed by Additional levee failure.

    Given the enormity of this disaster, only God herself could have pulled off a more Herculean effort to save, transport, treat and feed so many in such short order.

    Lessons WILL be learned about better ways to respond to the sheer scope of a disaster of this kind. Naysayers be damned. You’ll have plenty of time to bitch once you have all the facts. You’re not helping by criticizing when you don’t yet even have them. For example, anyone here have a reliable count on the number of people who, for whatever reason, remained in the city and now need EVERYTHING all at once? And don’t forget the the number of those who also Didn’t evacuate from the rest of the decimated Gulf Coast region.

    Anyone? If you can’t even answer that basic question, guess you’re not God either.

    So how many people is it, EXACTLY, that needed/still need saving, transport, food, water, etc. *immediately*, over an area the size of Britain? Without passable highways and without means of communication?

    Tragedy, yes.

  • Gray

    Bob, really no offense intended, but I don’t think it would have been imposible to have plans ready for the 50 major residential areas in the US. You’re right about logistic, but all those 2500 FEMA vacationers had to do was creating the links to the national support units, checking the available resources and working out their emergency plans. In case of a serious warning, all they had to do was grab their plan and start with their equivalent of defcon 3 or 2. 50 specialists per target area should have accomplished something. The efforts would have been visible by now. The reports out of the desaster area don’t indicate that there’s a coordinated effort for supply and evacuation.
    Just look at this Brown jerk in the TV. Do you believe he’s a leader type guy who gets things done?

  • Gray

    Eileen, is ‘The disaster zone is the size of Britain’? Britain has about 244000 km², Louisiana 133000 and Missisipi 125000. Not all of the states is a desaster area, so pls check this fact again. Sry, I’m too tired to help you get the other facts straight. GN

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  • Grray

    Eileen, is ‘The disaster zone is the size of Britain’? Britain has about 244000 km², Louisiana 133000 and Missisipi 125000. Not all of the states is a desaster area, so pls check this fact again. Sry, I’m too tired to help you get the other facts straight. GN

  • http://www.precommerce.com Craig Danuloff

    If a terrorist attack had caused this damage (how hard could it have been to explode something next to one of those levys) wouldn’t we all be asking why 4 years after 9-11 the Dept Of Homeland Security isn’t prepared to evacuate a city and serve up relief? Of course we would. They have accomplished nothing in 4 years. Nothing in airports and nothing in this regard.

    Secondly, as has been well documented, everyone knew those levys were rated at category 3 and yet category 4 or 5 storms are possible at any time. So year after year after year the politicians placed the bet. They lost and others are paying. Those walls should have been rated for a Category 10 hurricane -10 feed thick then 30 yards of dirt then another 10 feet of concrete. They looked about 1ft thick on tv. You can’t be any more surprised that they fell than that terrorist used airplanes as weapons.

    I HOPE Jeff is right about the political careers that this sinks. I predict Bush to have an approval rating of about 10% at this time next week.

  • Robert Day

    So much for compassionate conservativism.

  • Eileen

    Well Gray, that’s what our MSM calculated, as I heard it on the nightly news.

  • Ravo

    So Angelos, they took the buses from the rich white people that paid for them and gave them to the poor black people.

    Gee, maybe you can give them a pass now, one for being born white, forgive them o please for that….

    and one for working hard..at least it sounds like that woman speaking did…all their lives….oh forgive them my son.

    You racist bigot you…kiss my white ^%$&

  • http://www.feedwriter.com Greg Burton

    Eileen, you’re right about the scale of this. You don’t need exact numbers, or to think you’re God, to see that we failed. And it’s not about Bush, really. WE failed. The infrastructure failed, both the physical and the social. Carson is right that part of this was communications system failure – but he omits that emergency systems still aren’t interoperable, four years after 9/11. Those systems, and the method for getting them into place, failed as well.

    Could the hurricane have been prevented? No. Is there evidence of systemic failure in responding to it? Yes. Did we know this was coming, eventually? Yes. Did we fail to adequately prepare? Yes.

    No one is dancing in the streets at this failure. It is our failure, collectively. I don’t care much about blame, though accountability is required. What I care about is learning as much as we can to ensure that this level of failure doesn’t happen again.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    From Reuters:

    Federal disaster declarations covered 90,000 square miles

    (234,000 square kilometers) along the U.S. Gulf Coast, an area roughly the size of Britain. As many as 400,000 people had been forced to leave their homes.

  • http://www.varifrank.com Frank martin

    Does it occur to anyone that the very people you are castigating also lost everything in the disaster? The people everyone counted on to have the plans and to be on the job afterwards were also wiped out in this disaster. This is not a simple high water mark on some rich folks barrier island vacation homes, this is the utter destruction of 4 major cities, I dont remember any of us walking around last week saying how much we knew about how this was going to play out.

    We all sit miles away from the disaster ready to pass judgement, but can any of us have any idea what it must be like to be a low paid civil servant reporting to work, knowing that your house is underwater and your family is missing and theres 100,000 angry wet hungry people staring at you for answers?

    Should the Mayor have declared martial law 24 hours prior to the landing of the hurricane? Maybe, but would you have supported him? Were there any sort of facilities, any people to carry off such a plan? Could you even implement that today even with all the clear need in full light of day? Were not talking about a few office blocks, this is city after city that needed to be fully evacuated, and where would you have evacutaed? Its just as likely that Houston was going to be hit as was New Orleans.Mybe Biloxi, oh whoops that got scratched too. We have no idea how to do this sort of mass migration, even today. We are now evacuating to Houston in full daylight outside of the storm and it still takes time to move people en masse that far away.

    Stop thinking of this as a Hurricane and start thinking of this as an atomic bombing and you can start to see what happened here was just beyond anyones ability to deal with it. The hurricane didnt just destroy the buildings, it destroyed the authority and the infrastructure of government as well.

    The lesson here is that in true large scale disasters, you cant count on the locals to even be there to take the lead. The assumption has to be that the locals are gone and cannot take part in their own rescue. That is not an assumption we make today in our planning, all planning says the locals “drive the show”. Katrina showed the weakness in that idea.

    I have my issues with the way this was handled, but for now Im keeping it to my self. None of this half assed monday morning quarterbacking is going to do a damn thing to get those people out of there.

    We all learned from this disaster, and none of us is going to get out of it without some of it on us. Weve all learned a valuable lesson that modern man doesnt like to admit very often but its true nonetheless – there are things in the world that you dont have control over that are much much bigger than you, and on occasion they can and often do reach out and bite your ass. Modern man is pretty cool and has lost of nice toys, but nature is much bigger than man and in the end, nature will always win.

    Things are possibly going to get much much worse. When you have large numbers of people in that kind of water, Cholera is not far from the future. Western people have no idea what cholera is, but I fear we are about to learn. We are probably within 24 hours of a cholera outbreak in this area. Ladies and gentleman, if that occurs and god help us all if it does, you will look back on these last 4 days as “when things werent so bad”.

    Stop looking for someone to blame and start looking for a way to help, were full up on critics at the moment we could use a few more “backs” in the process of getting these people out.

  • John

    Hey Mr. President…meet your good budy Nero…

    http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050830/480/capm10108301730

  • Eileen

    Greg,

    I agree with most of what you’ve said. However, due to the magnitude and scope of this *natural disaster* I’m not prepared to label our relief effort an utter failure at this point. Hell, it’s just getting rolling. When all is said and done, how many people needed saving, and how many did we *in fact* save? That’s the baseline in my view.

    Should we also have planned for the eventuality that not even one highway in the NO area would exist after such an unprecedented-in-size storm? How many helicopters would it take to ferry out UNKNOWN NUMBERS of those who DIDN’T EVACUATE? Where would they come from? How long would it take to evacuate 75+K humans by helicopter or small boats that could fit on city streets? No one knew *precisely* where the greatest damage would occur; to wit: Katrina veered at the last moment, thank God(?).

    There are so many variables which combined to ‘create’ this tragedy. Some are institutional/infrastructural, as you say, but some are not.

    We’re still in the midst. After the still unknown numbers get saved and the dead are buried, let’s assign blame. And learn.

  • http://www.sextoysparty.com Jim

    Yea its to bad they did not tac on another 10 billion to build refiniers. It has my vote!!!

  • Robert Day

    It seems to me that our government did a better job supporting the folks that got hit by the tsunami, than our own people in the Gulf Coast. There is no reason why people should be starving, dehydrating, and dying in the United States of America. All this talk by FEMA and Department of Homeland Security about how everything is under control is a bunch of political BS. It is PR spin at its worse. The government needs to admit that there is no control over the situation, but that it will deploy all assets (not just the National Guard) necessary to take care of the people effected. I am sorry but this country cannot afford to have the Republicans in charge, if this is the best that they can do.

  • Eileen

    As I understand it, Robert, most branches of our military also been deployed.

    Fer cryin’ out loud, stop with the Repub bashing. (And I’m not even a Repub.)

    Get real. This was a MONSTER of a natural disaster. Humans are currently doing their best to save other humans. Try supporting them for a change. Save your political posturing for another day.

    Thanks, Frank, for your erudite observations. And also to you Carson Fire, as ever.

  • Robert Day

    No Eileen. You get real. When you have Mr. Brown of FEMA blaming the people themselves for not evacuating, when many of them did not have the financial resources to leave, then there is a serious disconnect. Do you think that the response would be this slow if D.C. was hit by a natural disaster or L.A. was totally destroyed by an earthquake. I think not?

  • http://erasend.blogspot.com kingdom2000

    This event will mark the moment the US could no longer be called a Superpower.

  • Eileen

    I heard his comments [and btw, I'm not overly impressed with him]. But many with resources DID choose not to leave. I watched MSNBC on Sunday night. They interviewed too many to count who simply chose NOT to leave. How many? I don’t know. Neither do you. And btw, they haven’t been interviewed again in the aftermath.

    Fact is, we still don’t know how many survivors who didn’t leave – for whatever reason – we need to save.

    I’ve been broke before. You? I know what it means not to have a working car or gas money. I would be the last person On Earth to criticize someone for their financial misfortune. But there are – it’s a safe bet – Many Thousands across the Gulf region who had the means, but chose NOT to evacuate, even when ordered to.

    Slow response? How many WILL we save versus how many are LEFT ALIVE to save? At this point, you don’t even know. Nor do I. How many stayed? Of those, how many died? No one knows. No one will probably ever know. That’s part of this monstrous tragedy.

    Let’s see how this pans out, as I said, and then learn from it.

  • Eileen

    Sean in Baton Rouge and your Mary and your baby….and Candice. Please, when you are able, let us know how you fare.

    G’night All.

    Prayers for the survivors of Katrina.

  • Bostoniangirl

    Robert Day,

    Thanks for pointing out that a lot of people didn’t have the financial means to leave. It’s also important to note that the evacuation was ordered on Sunday. Greyhound and Amtrak were, I believe, shut down on Saturday. A lot of those people didn’t own cars.

    So what, Eileen, do you think that they should have done?

  • http://www.perrspectives.com AvengingAngel

    Now should not be the time, as Kevin Drum of the Washington Monthly has noted, for the politics of blame. In the wake of Katrina’s devastation along the Gulf Coast, Americans should be united in providing relief, resources and support to all in need.

    But sadly, that massive relief effort will take place during a time of divisive and fundamental debate about the very meaning of national unity in the United States. As New Orleans struggles for survival, the President and his amen corner are waging a full scale assault on the Estate Tax, what they derisively (and effectively )term the “Death Tax.” They will continue to pursue this massive transfer of the U.S. treasury to America’s wealthiest, even as a mountain of evidence shows that successive Bush budget cuts devastated New Orleans’ disaster preparedness and levee maintenance…

    For the full story, see:

    “New Orleans Pays the Death Tax.”

  • http://www.childrenoftheuniverse.com Clarence

    I posted this quote from the Los Angeles Times on http://www.childrenoftheuniverse.com

    “For years, studies by federal and other authorities had pinpointed New Orleans as one of the most vulnerable areas in the country for a natural disaster…”

    When your city is that vulnerable you don’t wait for a disaster to start thinking about what to do – planning and preparation is the responsibility of those in authority. The results of this flood have been scripted out for years. A response should have been cocked and ready to fire.

  • http://www.counterpunch.org/barry04012005.html “Shirt”off Chertoff

    Lets look at the track record of failures in any Chertoff “aftermath ”
    http://www.counterpunch.org/barry04012005.html

    This nation needs to IMMEDIATELY review the plain fact… does this man even have the ability to serve this nation in helping the helpless citizens screaming for help.

    All this country has seen is rhetoric and speeches. The citizens need and needed help for several days now… we do NOT need to hear “we are trying our best”… they heard that but there is NO arrival of the so called help for DAYS now! Turn on your TV and see for yourself…

    Would we are Americans believe speeches or the stark and bleak visuals on every broadcast channel across the world! Chertoff OFF!

  • Kabri

    I am sickened and ashamed and scared too death that the people of New Orleans have been treated in this way. I imagine Mississippi is not getting great treatment either. I agree with most of you here. All this capability and we can’t manage dropping food, water, and baby formula from helicopters down to the ground. I could say more, but I think we have all said it. We can not let our government forget this. I have donated money for four days, but it is not helping them RIGHT NOW. I feel sad and helpless. If anyone from more a more northern place in Louisana reads this, please, if you ever see or meet someone that survives this, tell them they were not forgotten by the rest of the everyday folks in the nation and that we felt very upset and ashamed. I have written 25 State Senators tonight and the President-I encourage everyone to do so. This has been an outrage. I am so sorry Louisiana and all States affected by Katrina. I am an Andrew Survivor and I know what the after affects are like.

  • JMD

    I definitely agree there are many ways the response to this disaster, and the planning before, could have been handled much better. But I also think we’re laboring under an illusion if we believe that just enough funding, just enough federal involvement or just the right administration would prevent a major natural disaster from being a disaster.

    Perhaps it’s my conservative bent (though I still love your blog, Jeff), but no amount of funding or planning will completely prevent something bad from happening. I think many of us are confusing causes.

    Many decisions might have been made that, in hindsight, we conclude increased the problems associated with this disaster. I really think, though, that’s “quibbling over 2%”–and it’s more suited to a dry, tedious study by some commission in the future.

    The simple fact is, we are neither omnipotent nor omniscient. Long before we reached a level of planning and preparation that would effectively eliminate the danger from natural disasters, we would find our society a completely intolerable place in which to live.

    I’m not trying to be cold or callous. In fact, I’m trying to redirect the emphasis to the attempt to salvage what’s left of the suffering population of New Orleans and the surrounding areas.

  • Eileen

    Well, Boston, what should ANY of us do in the face of calamities of all kinds? NONE of us are immune, regardless of our ‘current’ stations in life. For example, my relatively wealthy sister, her husband and family *also* just lost their home, jobs and very existence in NO. I’ve offered my own home to them in the aftermath… If anything, Katrina will be remembered as the great leveller. Aren’t ALL calamities great levellers?

    I’m merely pointing out some baselines; i.e., until we know how many survived and need to be saved, and until we see how well we fared in actually saving them, we should stop the bashing.

  • Kabri

    Eileen and other Experts-

    What you are saying is very sound. But, I really believe, supply drops since Monday, into the Super Dome and other areas would have prevented the folks from rioting from hunger, thirst, and desperation thus cutting off help for awhile. I went through Hurricane Andrew, all you want is your life preserved and a bottle of water-food is even a side issue-you stay alive out of fear.

  • Chertoff to help us?

    OK, would we allow ourselves to be “helped” by this Chertoff when and God Forbid when we are suddenly caught in dire straits?

    Lets get someone who CAN do the job and have done it right step in and HELP… not conduct meetings. Call on your elected officials now and let the citizens of this LAND BE HEARD. The nation for the nation … not POLITICKING BS while you lay dying…. Chertoff will bury you sooner that you can finish wondering what he can do to help us.

    LET this NATION put its FEET DOWN NOW. CALL your TV stations, newspapers, governor, senator, congress people… your civil activists etc
    ACT NOW, DELIVER or step down NOW. There is NO TIME to spin their political rhetoric… Exercise our GOD given rights as citizens – speak now and get the ones who can deliver and can serve… NOT pontificate and spin yarns. LEADERS who can SERVE, DELIVER and DO IT NOW! not tomorrow, not trying, not promising,… be on the scene with their hands on the job… Chertoff acts like he and his cronies are DEMI-GODs.

  • http://www.childrenoftheuniverse.com Clarence

    The New York Times makes this simple point:
    “… neighborhoods that were long known to be vulnerable to disaster if the levees failed. Without so much as a car or bus fare to escape ahead of time, they found themselves left behind by a failure to plan…

    No plan. No preparation.

  • Kabri

    JMD, I am a moderate Republican, but I am a human first. Do ya really mean what you say?? No one is talking about the government having fore knowledge of this, the outrage is that we don’t use our strengths. The government is the entity that coordinates us, they do promise to protect the people. Water, food, toliet paper…that is all that was required to sustain people until the big picture was all figured out. Have you not eaten, and I mean really, or drank, or watched your baby fade from dehydration over four days? I have been watching that for nearly a week and can not figure out why.

  • http://PersonalPride/Politicalcareer-Bushinquandary Bush accept or decline or ignore HELP from the human race

    Europe’s offer of petrol places Bush in quandary
    By Carola Hoyos and Javier Blas in London
    Published: September 1 2005 22:22 | Last updated: September 1 2005 22:22

    As news of massive, long-term damage at its refineries emerges, Washington appears to be in an unenviable position.

    Long criticised for having no energy policy and an insatiable demand for gas guzzlers fuelled by cheap petrol, the US must now decide whether to accept help from Europe.

    In so doing, US President George W. Bush would implicitly acknowledge some of his critics’ accusations and open himself up to demands for political and economic favours in return.

    Officials from member governments of the International Energy Agency said they were waiting only for the US to agree to such a measure. The IEA, the organisation that co-ordinates the release, would only say it was still assessing whether the size of the shortfall caused by Katrina warranted calling an emergency release.

    Germany has assured the IEA that it would participate if needed. This is particularly important because Germany holds the largest number of barrels of petrol in public storage. Public petrol barrels – those held by governments or agencies directly – are able to reach markets within one or two days, faster than emergency earmarked stocks held by companies.

    France and Spain, which, like Germany, have had strained relations with the US over trade and foreign policy, and Italy are the other European countries that would tap big emergency petrol stocks. All three are likely to demand a political or economic reward from Washington for their help.

    Europe has 168m barrels of petrol reserved for emergencies, with 53m of those held by governments or agencies. Japan, the US, Korea and the Netherlands all have public stockpiles of oil or products, such as petrol, diesel and heating oil, or both. The US holds only emergency stockpiles of crude oil.

    So far, the US has lost 5m barrels of petrol production because of the refinery damage caused by Katrina. Based on information from the US government yesterday, some analysts say that could swell to 52m, which would probably be enough to trigger an emergency plan by the IEA, they say.

    The plan would involve not only putting tens of millions of barrels of petrol – and perhaps also jet fuel – into the market but would also allow countries to curb demand through reducing speed limits by up to 25 per cent, mandating car-pooling or compressing the working week for civil servants.

    The IEA is not the only group willing to help. Venezuela, a member of the Organisation of Petroleum Exporting Countries but not a member of the IEA, has offered to send petrol to the US. It has strategically well-placed storage tanks on Curaçao island, which houses the hemisphere’s biggest refinery, and Borco in the Bahamas.

    Whether Mr Bush would be pleased to accept aid from one of his most vocal opponents is less certain.

    There are other hurdles for petrol coming to the US as well. Pipelines have been ruined by the storm and port facilities are also badly damaged. The US yesterday reduced its environmental restrictions on petrol. But traders say there are other laws that still prohibit certain types of petrol from being imported. This problem would be solved if the IEA called an emergency, agency officials said.

    Nevertheless, the market is already starting to compensate. Some petrol meant for European consumption has been redirected to the US. Some 20 tankers have been booked to cross the Atlantic month, prompting a rise in tanker rates.

    Petrol is not the only problem. As winter approaches, heating oil supplies will become critical. But the destruction of production of natural gas, also used for heating, has begun driving heating oil prices in the US higher. US commercial inventories of distillates are 4.3 per cent higher than last year’s levels. But the loss of refining capacity and the fact that some refiners have switched from making heating oil to filling the immediate need for petrol could spell trouble for the winter, analysts said.

    Some refiners who are unable to get supplies of oil have requested loans of oil, but at least one company yesterday cancelled its request. The bigger problem is that eight refineries are still closed and unable to process crude oil into petrol. A further 12 have been compromised.

  • Eileen

    Kabri,

    Re your comment addressed to me: I couldn’t agree with your more. I am horrified that we did not drop food and water sooner. Horrified! Quite frankly, there IS no excuse. For this lapse, we as a nation are responsible for how many deaths? Two? One is too many.

    But of course MSM did NOT cover the fact that we HAVE dropped food and water. What accounts for that ‘breach’ in ‘fair and balanced’ news coverage??

    For the same ‘ole, same ‘ole reasons.

    As I’ve said, let’s assess when we determine *how many* we saved of those *who were alive to save* after Katrina. Only then will we know how well we stepped up to the plate. Not before. And no amount of rhetoric will change it.

  • http://countertop-chronicles.blogspot.com countertop

    And to think, yesterday was the kick off of national preparedness month. Ugh.

    DHS officials were at Union Station today all cheerful for the media, handing out pathetic little emergency preparation checklists to the public, so Mr. & Mrs. American could be prepared. What crock. When I questioned why they didn’t include the recommendation that everyone have a gun or some other legitimate means of self defense on their checklists they looked at me incredulously and couldn’t believe that I would doubt their inability to provide for basic safety during a civil emergency.

    What a pathetic, sad joke.

  • Pingback: Jackie Danicki » America’s shame

  • Eileen

    And what ARE the results, Jackie?

    Fact is, you don’t even know yet.

    Simple question. Why are you so quick to judge this administration in the face of a major NATURAL disaster? What are your motivations?

    BOTTOM LINE::: How many survivors of Katrina ultimately survived due to our efforts, of those who were left living?

    Anyone who wishes to judge in advance of that basic question is motivated not by compassion, but by politics.

    YOU DON’T KNOW YET. So pleaaaasssseee stop judging.

  • Pingback: The Tattered Coat » Blog Archive » The Bridge to Nowhere

  • Petro

    I can’t BELIEVE you people.

    Disgusting. Really disgusting.

    You have NO CLUE what rescue efforts entail, what it takes to shift people and material over 100s of miles of randomly destroyed terrain in any sort of organized fashion, you’ve got no idea AT ALL what it takes to feed and house the people DOING the relief work, much less what it takes to actually get the job done.

    One of the pissant little socialists here said:

    “”"
    And yes, BOB, Americans pay taxes so that this kind of situation never happens.
    “”"
    Really, tax dollars prevent hurricanes?

    Oh, you mean you’re willing to spend upwards of a billion dollars a year nationally (in FY2000 FEMA requested 300 billion for disaster releif, this is one agency, and doesn’t include Coast Guard or National Guard budgets etc.) to keep men and material prepared for the kinds of disasters that happen once every decade or two?

    Like hell you are. You’d be one of the first to whine about how that money could go to…well, let’s not get any nastier.

    “”"
    I cannot believe this is our country. The government should have been mobilized and ready to go on MONDAY!
    “”"

    They were. Bush made the “Disaster Area” declaration before the storm hit land.

    Do some math would you PLEASE? I realize it’s “linear thinking”, and “hard”, but just stop and figure:

    Let n be the number of buses needed to to shift people from one place to the other.
    Let x be the number of miles you need to shift these people to get them to “saftey”.
    Let y be the number of people you can shift per bus.
    Let p be the total population you’ve got to move.
    Let h be the time you’ve got to move them in.

    The simple calculation is:
    n=p/y

    How many people on a bus? Well, let’s assume a big bus, I think that’s around 70 people, and we’re going to move them 300 miles from the coast (the effected area reaches inland /at least/ 120 miles, my daughter lives in Central MS, and as of 3 this afternoon they were w/out power and she was heading to Atlanta to be with her mom)

    How many people have we got to move? 2000:

    29=2000/70 (this is integer math, we get whole buses so we round up).

    10000 people:
    143 buses.

    100,000 people:
    1429 busses.

    Now, 1429 buses is a lot. And that’s also 1429 drivers that have to be gotten somewhere on time etc. Where are you going to get that many? You won’t. You can’t. The buses in the damaged areas cannot be planned on, nor can the drivers (they have families etc.). So you do with fewer buses but make multiple trips, this gets even worse, because now you add time into it, and it becomes about how long it takes to shift people, and how many you can shift per trip or hour.

    All this takes planning. And shifting resources around (buses have to be fueled people have to be fed and watered etc.).

    And 100,000 is only 1/10th-1/12th of hte people in that area. In addition to just shifting these people you’ve got medical problems, rescue problems etc.

    And you /cannot/ pre-plan and pre-stage because you don’t know where the damage will happen, so you can’t count on any particular route being open, and you can’t count on any particular *close* spot being safe, and if you’re too far away you’re running low on fuel inside the damage zone and and and and.

    70 per bus, 300 miles each way. 60 miles per hour. That’s 70 people per bus in per 10 hours. Or 7 people per hour per bus.

    You’ve got 100,000 people to shift, which means (basically) 14286 bus hours, so 10 buses finishes the job in 1428 hours, 100 finishes in 142 hours (actually add 5 to that for 1 one way trip). To get 100,000 people shifted in 48 hours you’re going to need roughly 298 buses. Which is also 298 drivers. This is all, of course, assuming that things go smoothly. You could probably gather up 3oo school buses from the states around the affected areas and get them in, but school buses are smaller (IIRC about 40 adults) than what I was talking about. WHich means almost (fudging because of the hour) twice as many buses and drivers.

    Right after a hurricane. And we haven’t even begun to talk about how many buses go to where and at what time. Or about how to handle medical problems on the bus, feed the people etc. Hell, even refueling the buses.

    And note, we’re just talking about getting 100,000 people out of New Orleans and the surrounding area.

    And we didn’t /know/ it was going to be New Orleans until Saturday/Sunday.

    And on Tuesday morning (before the levee gave way) it looked like things were going to be, well, not ok, but not worse-case. So the planners started shifting resources and planning to the areas that were obviously going to need it.

    Then the damn broke.

    There are good reasons why there are NO large scale evacuation plans for any metropolitan are in this country. You simply CANNOT plan that sort of thing. Really, Really bright people have tried, and they keep realizing it DOES NOT WORK.

    Reality is NOT ameniable to our desires /just/ because we wish it. Maybe someday we’ll be able to predict this stuff 2-3 weeks out with reasonable accuracy, and get people out of the way in time. Now we cannot, so we have to clean up afterwards.

    The government is moving just as fast (or faster) on this disaster as they have in all the others, it’s just that now information flows even faster, and we’re all–left, center and right–hurting for these people.

    (Asside: why did people stay in the path of a Cat 4/5 hurricane? Because the leftist school system, coupled with the Christian foot stomping over science has left people without a basic understanding of weather, physics and math? Well, partly. Because there is still a perception of Meterologists being completely WRONG? Well, partly. Because of 2 decades of media/newspapers predicting TEOTWAWKI and it turns out to be not that big a deal? Partly. Because many were too poor to leave? Sure. Teach people math and physics and they’ll move when they realize how much energy is coming straight at them).

    But you’re not interested in that, because that makes Bush (in this case) just someone reacting to events outside ANYONEs control, and that means you can’t whine more about him.

    And quite frankly that petty, lame, and rather small.

  • Sgt. Hulka

    Gov. Blanco is inept. Period. Other than tearing up, what the hell has this dingbat done?

  • Eileen

    Petro,

    Kisses and applause!!!

    Jeff Jarvis,

    The very fact you would quote Angelos….??? No words for that one.

  • http://www.paradox1x.org Karl

    Speaking of not having the financial resources to leave… I finally posted something about my childhood. With so many vilifying the victims… I had to share a small piece of my experience –

    I hope no one minds the link.

  • http://blog.electricorange.com ElectricOrange

    Wish that I had gotten in on this earlier. I cannot believe that anybody has time to start fingerpointing while this disaster is still going on. Would the situation have been different if the levees had been taller and stronger? Who the hell knows? At this point, it doesn’t matter. The situation is what it is, and it is awful and unprecedented.

    The rescue/relief effort in New Orleans is different from that in any other situation you’ve ever witnessed. As the entire city (and much of the surrounding Parishes) is underwater, search and rescue has spent four days flying by helicopter over rooftops that have essentially become islands. Every place in New Orleans that is dry and inhabitable is essentially an island.

    These islands number in the tens of thousands, with each one potentially being a place where a survivor is hidden away. If you had a thousand helicopters immediately dispatched to the area, it would still have taken days just to find the survivors and get them to the larger “islands,” such as the Superdome and the Convention Center.

    And now, there are hundreds of these larger islands. Nobody has an accurate account of how many people are in each one, and you still have to go at them one at a time. I know New Orleans well, and sure there are TV cameras at the Convention Center, but I’m certain that if anybody could get down the the Riverbend area near where Carrolton and St. Charles Avenues meet, that there are hundreds of people there. And along Gentilly and Esplanade near the fairgrounds where land is higher. And along the levee at the park behind the Audubon Zoo, which is dry. And in tons of other places too. St. Bernard Parish is completely screwed, with thousands marooned and hungry, but the majority of resources are going to the city.

    Believe me when I tell you, there was no way to adequately plan in advance for this particular disaster. You just have to take the events as they come and systematically deal with the issues according to the priorities you set and change as events move.

    First, you save the people whose lives are immediately threatened. Second, you move them to higher ground. Third, you restore order. Fourth, you get supplies in and distribute them where you can. All the while, you get as many people out as you can. And then you figure out what to do with them from there.

    Whatever led anyone to think this couldn’t happen in America, or shouldn’t happen in America, is beyond me. Mother Nature doesn’t give a damn whether you’re American. And it takes as much time to sort out logistics in New Orleans, Louisiana as it does in Phuket, Thailand.

    Nobody is being intentionally ignored or singled out. Death and destruction are very democratic in disaster-stricken areas.

    As for the politicians, I’m no fan of Bush or Blanco or Nagin or any of them, even on the best of days. But laying out blame helps nobody at this point. I’m sure that once the survivors are sheltered, fed, and clothed, once the water is pumped out, and people start to piece together their lives, at that point there will be more than enough time for the blogosphere’s self-proclaimed experts to assign blame.

    If you absolutely feel the urgent need to hold somebody responsible, don’t hesitate to point the finger of blame at me. I can safely say I never saw this coming, didn’t prepare for it, and have not personally sent any food or water to the Convention Center. I’ll take the responsibility, while the people who need to do their jobs go ahead and do just that.

    For now, I truly believe that everybody is doing the absolute most they can in the midst of complete and total chaos and desperation. If Jeff had one good thing to say in all of this, it’s that everybody should contribute what they can to the relief effort. If you live anywhere near the affected areas, think about opening your homes to the displaced. When the call comes, consider going down there to volunteer in the recovery/rebuilding effort (or whatever evolves).

  • ptritsch

    Petro:

    THANK YOU for oh-so-methodically debunking the hysterical rantings of the off-with-their heads crowd (well, only if they’re Republican heads–Bush’s first, naturally.) Such glee at a potential loss of his political clout in the face of horrible human tragedy is beyond repulsive. One has only to look at the satellite images of the area involved to understand the logistical nightmare involved in getting goods and appropriate personnel in safely and unknown numbers of victims out in equal safety.

    Sadly, it seems far too many of us view the world through the distorted prisms of cheesy ninety-minute Hollywood disaster flicks, the voracious 24 hour news cycle eager for bad news/scandal/unsubstantiated rumor and a spoiled brat populace demanding instant remedies for every ill, real or imaginary. (I just caught an interview with a recently rescued woman who, instead of expressing gratitude for being alive, complained shrilly and with great indignation that the “military food” she’d been given at a shelter tasted terrible–and besides it was cold. So what–she expected haute cuisine, served piping hot on damask cloth? Sheesh.)

    The same dynamic seems at play with the armchair quarterbacks who equally shrilly demand perfection from Bush et al. Did these same “folks” (Lord, how the lefties hate it when Bush uses that Texas jargon!)–did these same folks yell “Off with their heads!” after Waco or when Elian Gonzalez was ripped out of his aunt’s arms by Spec Ops types at gunpoint? After Oklahoma City, did they excoriate Clinton for not anticipation such an occurrence? Hmm, methinks not. But then, Billy is great in front of a camera, isn’t he? Style trumps substance, right?

    No administration, no President is infallible. Undoubtedly mistakes have been made, but not for lack of trying, nor for all the nefarious reasons the Blame America/Hate Bush crowd loves to spout.

    From all I’ve read, NO was both a disaster and a riot waiting to happen. One of my most vivid memories while visiting the city in the early nineties was a rent-a-cop stationed in the lobby of the Marriott vehemently lecturing several of us on how to stay safe in the French Quarter. Looking back now, his advice seems reminiscent of advice one would offer to a visitor to Baghdad.

    Is is Bush’s fault that the city didn’t crack down on the culture of thuggery before Katrina? Or that the NO city government didn’t anticipate the lawlessness and have a contingency plan? (Just wait until a looter gets his head blown off by a National Guardsman and, boy howdy, then listen to the screams! How DARE Bushitler send in the MILITARY! What about posse comitatus? Can you say impeachment? Sheesh, no wonder the man looked exhausted.)

    My point, such as it is, is that the heart and soul of America is being eroded away by the acid of this irrational coiffed Howard hatred. I never thought I’d see the day when bringing down a President was more important to far too many of my fellow citizens than winning a war against barbaric murderers. Or the day when political gain takes precedence over love-thy-neighbor humanity.

    Sadly, that day seems to be dawning, even here at what I considered one of the most balanced and reasoned forums. Katrina and its aftermath is a tragedy of biblical proportions, yes, but, Jeff, I think it’s way too soon to call it a scandal. Unless, of course, one has a political bias/agenda.

    Which, clearly, many here do. Sadly.

  • http://ruthcalvo Ruth

    Now we have real public policy initiative, the administration is requesting people avoid travel over Labor Day, to keep from exhausting the gasoline supply. Did anyone hear a snort of laughter out there?

    Jerry Lewis is devoting a part of his MD Labor Day telethon too hurrican victims. That is lovely.

    What’s revolting is laying blame or absolving, when the issue right now is help, and as much as quick as possible, from ALL sectors.

  • Liam

    I speak with no technical knowledge of disaster planning and I know nothing about the logistics on the ground. I am a supporter of George W Bush and the war on terror. I am, naturally, what could be called a neo-con . I also think that the armed gangs roaming the streets of New Orleans have a lot to answer for. However all that being said, some images and issues stick in my mind:

    1. A chinook helicopter taking on people in a large open area near the superdome. I just can’t help but think that area would look better if it were filling up with tents, porta potties and maybe a Army field hospital.

    2. Michael Chertoff anouncing national preparedness day, yesterday.

    The blame for this should not yet be an issue and it will no doubt find a home in many places and at many levels

    For all that I just wish someone would grab a hold of this disaster by the scruff of the neck and make things happen.

  • http://www.buzzmachine.com Jeff Jarvis

    Petro:
    One question: What does it take to get water to the convention center? Start there. Tht’s what we’re talking about: Calculate how many bottles of water could fit on one of your buses.

  • http://www.paradox1x.org Karl

    We could drop supplies from the air in Berlin – in 1948 – but not New Orleans – in 2005?

  • http://www.stepheduncanjr.com Stephen Duncan Jr

    Read this article from a National Guardsmen from Florida who is very familiar with the logistics of hurricane relief: http://iraqnow.blogspot.com/2005/09/logistics-of-disaster-relief.html

  • Fred

    Hooray for Stephen Duncan Jr. Blow up your TV.

  • Liam

    Whilst I totally accept the logistics of this are immensely difficult I do know that a Chinook is a mightily capable heavy lift helicopter. If a large amount of people are ill, dehydrated and in need of medical treatment at one spot, like the superdome, then surely its might be fairly straightforward to “Chinook” in some emergency supplies? I am not trying to sit in judgment over the effort. If any nation can sort this type of problem out its the US with the support of what is without doubt the finest military the world has ever seen. For all I know it might even be that this has been done. But it seems like it has not. Funny isn’t it the TV stations are all up and running down there with their sat dishes etc. By the way I am a Brit and I hate to see a nation that has saved mine from destruction suffer so badly.

  • Gray

    The last internet co. of NO still standing is regularly updating their Jatrina blog. The blogger is ex-soldier, a no-nosense law and order type of guy. He has an eyewitness account about the situation at the convention center:
    http://www.livejournal.com/users/interdictor/

    ‘It’s been 3 days, and the buses have yet to appear.

    Although obviously he has no exact count, he estimates more than 10,000 people are packed into and around and outside the convention center still waiting for the buses. They had no food, no water, and no medicine for the last three days, until today, when the National Guard drove over the bridge above them, and tossed out supplies over the side crashing down to the ground below. Much of the supplies were destroyed from the drop.’

    All those aplogists here: No response for 72 hours, wrong informations for the refugees, and now valuable resources are wasted. No on in charge. Do you really want to make us believe that this is unavoidable?

  • http://orlandobound.blogspot.com John Frost

    I went to bed last night angry and woke up this morning inspired. It’s time to affect change so that we are never unprepared again. If this had been a terrorist attack or natural disaster with little or no warning, we would be talking about a human tragedy 10-times the scale we’re seeing right now. The nation has had four years since 9-11 to get something in place for a large scale disaster but as we can see, nothing effective has been done. In fact, money that could have lessened the impact of this particular disaster (one that was predicted many times for many years) had been cut. The folks in charge up in Washington now have a choice either fix the problem immediately or find themselves voted out at the next elections.

    The answer I’m leaning to right now is a civil defense corp. Whether or not you agree with our nation’s armed forces, reserves, and nat’l guard being stationed in Iraq right now, it’s a situation we have to deal with. While plans were being drawn up to invade, federal level plans to replace the resources those lost reservists and guard members provided should also have been drawn up. In the past in the U.S. and in other nations that role was played by the Civil Defense Corps. Large groups of citizens, with some from every neighborhood, who are trained to deal with disasters, operate and distribute propositioned equipment and supplies, and are looked to in their community as leaders in time of emergencies, can step into the role of managing people in their communities during emergencies. This releases the National Guard members that are left as well as police and emergency personal to perform rescue missions and keep the peace as needed.

    Hindsight is twenty-twenty, but it is already clear that this is a failure of monumental proportions by members of the government from the top on down. What must be done immediately is to get resources to the stricken areas ASAP. That effort looks like it is finally materializing. In a few days congress must enact legislation that brings into existence the ‘civil defense corps’ with a budget for training and procuring the equipment and supplies necessary to deal with an emergency a magnitude larger than the one occurring right now. Only then will we begin to be ready for the next catastrophe.

  • John T

    I strongly agree with those who say that this is no time to begin the blame game and subsequent butt covering.

    It seems as though the finger pointing has begun in earnest nevertheless.

    I detect a spin in the Liberal Media that the blame belongs to the Feds.

    I believe it is important to note that those primarily responsible for acting effectively before and after this catastrophe are the elected officials of New Orleans and the State of Louisiana.

  • Liam

    I read today that some Islamist websites are calling the disaster “Private Katrina”. Those barbaric fools seem to have forgotten that the Tsunami affected Indonesia the world’s most populous muslim nation and the US responded with nothing but kindness and compassion.

    But I have to ask this question – the armed gangs that have got so much attention. They seem not to be looting but trying exacerbate the situation. There has been talk of links between street gangs, prison and al-qaeda. Could there be a link to the armed lunstics and jihadist cells ? I don’t mean to wander off at a tangent but that could well be an explanation for the inexplicable.

  • JJB

    My god, did you see Bush’s impromptu press conference. Long-term help? Looking forward to his trip?! Only SIX HUNDRED MPs?!?!?! I can’t believe this is coming out of anyone’s mouth 5 days later, let alone the President’s. What a dark day in our history.

  • http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/bush_katrina&printer=1 NOT ACCEPTABLE on Browned Chertoff’ed efforts

    Bush Says Relief Results ‘Not Acceptable’

    By JENNIFER LOVEN, Associated Press Writer
    7 minutes ago

    President Bush, facing blistering criticism for his administration’s response to Hurricane Katrina, said Friday “the results are not acceptable” and pledged to bolster relief efforts with a personal trip to the Gulf Coast.

    “We’ll get on top of this situation,” Bush said, “and we’re going to help the people that need help.”

    He spoke on the White House grounds just boarding his presidential helicopter, Marine One, with Homeland Security Department secretary Michael Chertoff to tour the region. The department, which oversees the Federal Emergency Management Agency, has been accused of responding sluggishly to the deadly hurricane.

    “There’s a lot of aid surging toward those who’ve been affected. Millions of gallons of water. Millions of tons of food. We’re making progress about pulling people out of the Superdome,” the president said.

    For the first time, however, he stopped defending his administration’s response and criticized it. “A lot of people are working hard to help those who’ve been affected. The results are not acceptable,” he said. “I’m heading down there right now.”

  • http://www.drcookie.blogspot.com JennyD

    Clinton went on TV last night and took on those who are criticizing the administration’s response. He did it on CNN, and told all the nitpickers and naysayers that they had no idea what they were talking about. See the transcript here:

    http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/005360.php

  • http://www.phillyfuture.org Karl

    Here comes the approval ratings spike I talked about earlier…

    Damn they are good at making themselves look good.

  • John T

    Democrat city, Democrat state.

    You figure it out.

  • Angelos

    Yeah Revo, I’m the racist… You’re completely insane.

    But really, I’m beginning to see the point all you apologists are making. I mean, really, George and Dick and Condi et al were on vacation. It’s hard work bankrupting a nation. And you figure, it takes at least 3 days to pack up, book a commercial flight, and get back to DC.

    Look, I know you cannot break the laws of physics Jim. There are physical limits to the actual speed of operations. There were no limits on preparation though. And other than telling those who could to evacuate, there was none. This was a complete and utter failure on a local, state, and national level, and you people are fucking making excuses?!?! We pay their salaries, and you think this is OK?

    THIS is what you get from 4 years of Homeland Security preparation?

    I ask again (Eileen) – this is the best America can do?

    Where is the private sector? For the cost of 2-3 million dollars, Coca Cola could have sent 4 million bottles of water from Atlanta, and had it in NOLA on Wednesday. And there is probably a CLOSER bottling plant. After all, Dasani is just heavily-advertised tap water. That’s more goodwill than a Super Bowl ad could ever buy.

  • http://www.themediadrop.com Tom

    I gotta say that while I don’t lay blame at the national level in this particular case, the reaction and ability to help massive groups of people has been less than spectacular. If there was a reason we should just stick to isolationism when it comes to politics and support it’s looking at us right in the face. Watching what I saw on television last night for a few hours made me realize that people in other countries were seeing it and thinking “wow, they can’t even handle that kind of situation in their own country.”

    The fact of the matter is, if MSNBCCNNFOX can get journalists into the area with video and audio equipment, why can’t we get trucks or helicopters with supplies into a lot of these areas? The parishes that declared what amounted to martial law have done a lot better, apparently, than the rest of the areas. I hear a lot of talk from politicians saying they are being “ruthless” with looters, but do we have any reports of a looter being shot or shot at? Nope – whether or not that slippery slope is something we need to cross is a tough decision, but we’re certainly not donig any better by leaving the area when thousands of people need help. Seeing dead people in wheelchairs with paper notes on them with information for next of kin in our country, in a major city, let alone the outlying areas, is just too much.

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  • Hen o’ the woods

    All top FEMA and DHS personnel should be executed immediately as they are clearly worthless and in the way of helping the poor survivors. Maybe now people will wake up to the criminality of the Bush regime and turn their rage on the scum who are already profitting from this tragedy. Big Oil must be doing a jig knowing that they can now increase the price of gas at least !0% every day with impunity. Democrats who have sat back and taken the massive screwing should be disembowled on the steps of the Capitol, though they don’t deserve getting off so easily. When will this insanity end? When the heads of Bush, Cheney and every member of his criminal cabinet are perched atop the flagpoles ringing the Washington monument. Now that’s what I call compassionate conservatism!

  • Liam

    Given the evident hatred between people of the US who share different politics, particularly those who think of themselves liberal, I am surprised anything gets done. I really do not understand where the hatred and the bile that spits forth comes from. You should be pulling together.

  • Angelos

    Rock on, Hen!

  • kat

    The best thing they could do is send Rudy Guiliani.
    If the best Americans can do is have snipers shoot at rescue people and policemen,loot like the Baghdad terrorists, etc. then I am sadly disappointed. What kind of people are these??
    Hen is about as goofy as Randi Rhodes who suggests we are allowing these people to die because they are Black and Democrat. The stupidity of the Left never ceases to amaze me. Carry on, your gloating in time of crisis becomes your kind. Maybe you could dance in the streets and hand out candy.

  • Gray

    John T:
    Democrat city, Democrat state, Republican congress, Republican senate, Bush administration.

    You figure it out why all those flood prevention funds were slashed.
    The Louisiana officials did beg for the finances to bolster the levees. Even FEMA reported in 2001 that this desaster was among the three most likely to happen. The repubs crippled the funds for the engineering corps instead.
    There are several accounts of this criminal neglect, for example:
    http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001051313

  • Hen o’ the woods

    I would like nothing better than to pull together in the face of a tragedy, but when the tragedy is caused by individuals who then deny all responsibility and blame others, there is no common ground on which to stand, and someone needs to be voted (or pushed) off the island. When a convoy of aid to NO is delayed for a day because FEMA insists they have a registration number; when thousands slowly die bc. some ignorant slimebags can’t figure out how to deliver suupplies; when nobody can find vehicles to move refugees at the convention center and superdome to safety; when all this shit transpires openly; the only solution is for heads to roll. Maybe Halliburton could hire Zarqawi’s crew to come on down and start dispensing some real justice. If this criminal regime is not brought down by this unfolding scandal and unprecedented display of incompetence, then our society is doomed.

  • Liam

    I agree that heads should roll for the mess. I don’t think anybody would disagree with that. But it seems to me that its the machinery of the state that is causing the problems that and some bad government decisions about the New Orleans flood defences.

    I seem to remember when the democrats were in power they stood by and let over 1,000,000 people be slaughtered in Rwanda. I don’t think I would say that failure was caused by their antipathy toward Africans. Let’s apply the standards uniformly to all political parties and see where that leaves us.

  • Hen o’ the woods

    Heads should still roll for the complaceny on Rwanda that allowed the slaughter of a million people. They should roll for the slaughter of four million in Congo. They should roll for the ongoing slaughter in Iraq. One result of all these slaughters was establishment of an Intl. Criminal Court, but, gee, what has the GOPig position been on this issue? The Democraps share in responsibility for much of what sucks in this slimy greedfest spewed forth by Washington, but the GOPigs have upped the ante with policies that so blatantly against the laws of nature and common decency that they deserve summary execution as a first step in righting the wrongs. Once these pigs have been slaughtered (humanely of course – I am a pacifist at heart) or reeducated, then there might be a chance for real progress. It’s clear the US public is too ignorant, greedy and/or evil to rid society of these criminals through democratic means.

  • John T

    Gray,

    The obligation to prepare for contingencies such as how inform the populace, evacuate the city, mobilize and concentrate resources while maintaining the rule of law belongs to the local and state governments, which in this case, are both in the control of Democrats.

    As far as I can see, the only public official willing to step up to the plate and get things moving is President Bush.

    Blaming the President for not acting sooner is an admission of ineffectiveness on the part of the blamers.

  • Off Shore Pundit

    ABC Sydney Local Radio Drivetime has been interviewing Ozzies in NO.

    One was the director of a 60 bed holding pen err… nursing home with patients of an average age of 88. There are 16 staff. They have no AC, no power except for a small generator to power fans, no water or food. They cannot hold out another day.

    A 29 yo woman working as a lawyer and living in the FQ finally phoned home and is safe after riding out the storm with a 60 yo neighbour and her cat but they are running out of supplies.

    The mayor (Nagin?) ain’t as slick Guiliani but his interview on radio was very telling.

  • Liam

    “They should roll for the ongoing slaughter in Iraq” – Yes how about the many sunni muslims who want to slaughter and do slaughter their fellow muslims

    Hen – you sure you’re not really Mussolini or Pol Pot ? You seem to like the idea of re-education, de-humanisation and the killing your political foes, and you view the masses as ignorant. Oh yes that’s right, the left has always liked that way of doing business.

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  • Off Shore Pundit

    “Clinton went on TV last night and took on those who are criticizing the administration’s response. He did it on CNN, and told all the nitpickers and naysayers that they had no idea what they were talking about. See the transcript here:

    http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/005360.php

    Has willy boi gone over to the other side? What sort of favour did gWb hafta perform for that helping hand? Is there some sort of Preznits’ union?

    Seriously though Clinton made Bush look very bad

  • Angelos

    From Wonkette:

    But you know, the GOP could ensure Republican dominance to the end of the century if instead of heading to the airport, George Bush took Marine One to the Convention Center and just started handing out water.

    From Angelos:

    Seriously. You think Clinton wouldn’t be IN THERE, shaking hands, hugging, biting his lower lip and being sad, feeling some pain?

    Seriously, is Bush that afraid of the Negros?

    Kat, this is anger you’re hearing, babe, not gloating.

    Here’s come more compassionate conservativism:
    TALLAHASSEE – Hundreds of Katrina evacuees who fled to Tallahassee seeking refuge from the storm have been politely told by their hotels and motels to leave this weekend to make room for a football game: FSU vs. Miami.

    Here’s Reuters:
    The New Orleans disaster is already viewed as an illustration of what can go wrong in an American city under siege.

    “In many ways, this is a test of our national capacity,” said James Carafano, senior research fellow at the conservative Heritage Foundation. “If we can’t do this 24-7-365, we aren’t doing our job for preparedness.”

    But hey, what the hell are we doing, holding our elected officials to standards…

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    Hen: All top FEMA and DHS personnel should be executed immediately

    Angelos: Rock on, Hen!

    Again, the ugly victory lap of hatred. For the rest of this is *not* a matter of being apologists for the system, it’s a matter of being realistic, and, dare I say: SANE?

    The *biggest* scandal is that the levees required to protect New Orleans from a category 4 or 5 would be a massive project that would have taken at least 30 years to build. Get that? 30 freaking years. That’s decades of *national* disgrace and scandal by Republicans, Democrats, and independents alike. For this tragedy to have been avoided, we would have had to start major construction in the *70s*… and the government should have been on the fast track to doing this in the mid-60s, after the first horrific flooding. We have had many Republican and Democratic presidents since then, and it is foolish to try to lay this at the feet of any one. If Bush is guilty, then so is Clinton. If Clinton is guilty, then so is Reagan. And if Reagan is guilty, so is LBJ and Nixon. Not to mention everybody else who was in a position to make noise about it during all those decades. Who do we line up for execution first, Hen? We start with more recent politicians who might have done more to get the ball rolling, so that New Orleans might be ready to avert this kind of disaster by the year 2030, thirty years too late? Or do we first line up the old codgers who had time to do something about it?

    The “apologists” here recognize that ghouls like Angelos are trying to repeat their terrific performance from the Paul Wellstone memorial, hoping to gain political traction off of tragedy and rumor mongering. It didn’t work then, and it won’t work now; but it is still ugly and objectionable.

    I still have to credit JJ with not being political so much as emotional. He is angry… and so are we! But it is a mistake to listen to too many Angeloses and anti-Bush propaganda disguised as news. If we were under a Democratic administration, it would be just as moronic to listen to anti-Clinton propaganda during a tragedy like this. And, yes, some Republicans are prone to this kind of ugliness as well. That does not excuse it now.

  • Gray

    John T, you should be aware that the prez has the command over the US forces and their assets. Orders to the navy ships for example went out on wednesday, that’s just to late. The National Guard of Louisiana was activated monday, not friday after the dire warinings. Dunno who’s to blame for that, Blanco or Brown? One way or the other, it should have been clear that 3700 troops aren’t enough for an area of this size. I’m sure Blanco has not the command over the National Guards of the neighboring states, guess it would have been FEMAs job to get the reinforcements on the way.
    I guess there will be an interesting aftermath when all the failures will be discussed. But it should be clear right now that the emergency management was nowhere nearly sufficient. And that’s the opinion of the Prez, too: “The results are not acceptable”

  • http://www.agoyandhisblog.com/?p=85 goy

    Way to go, Jeff!

    People are dying. Babies, elderly, infirm, poor, not-poor, black, white and all shades, ages, conditions, social statuses and political persuasions in between are starving, dying of thirst, living in filth, surrounded by rotting corpses and living through the unimaginable trauma of losing everything. EVERYTHING!

    So yeah, by all means, let’s take our cues from the once-mainstream media and get right to the business of blaming those who had nothing to do with the cause of the problems and those who were physically incapable of getting aid to those in need due to impassable roads and lack of resources! Good form!!

    Not.

    There is only one culprit here, at least with respect to the tragedy of the aftermath in New Orleans. Whine all you want about the federal money for underdesigned levees, which in their best state of repair would have failed. Whine all you want about “slow” federal response (jeebus, is there any other kind of federal response!??!) to an unprecedented catastrophe, the magnitude of which was only just being fully realized three days ago. And whine all you want about what FEMA should be capable of (please!).

    The fact remains that the New Orleans city government’s Disaster Preparedness Plan can be distilled to a single word: denial. Nagin should quit blaming the feds for the results of his own criminal irresponsibility in this regard.

    We have a TRIAGE situation going on down there. In circumstances like these, every decision is going to have a downside and some people are going to just plain lose out. You want “reality-based”?? Take a good look.

    Trying to make political hay out of a triage situation is certainly the height of something. Something really ugly.

  • Off Shore Pundit

    Apparently your VP is still on vacation. That’s soooooooooooooo Cheney.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    Seriously. You think Clinton wouldn’t be IN THERE, shaking hands, hugging, biting his lower lip and being sad, feeling some pain?

    Seriously, is Bush that afraid of the Negros?

    Kat, this is anger you’re hearing, babe, not gloating.

    No, *that* is not anger or gloating, *that* is *hate*. You just slurred a guy who’s appointed more blacks to higher positions than any other president in history as being racist because he and his administration aren’t performing a fantasy that, if actually attempted, would make the job of the relief workers that much harder. To chance hampering the relief work by parading in front of cameras simply to score cheap political points — hopefully that would be beneath even Clinton. But are you really suggesting that he would stoop so low?

    It is a stupid, asinine idea, but that isn’t the point, is it? It’s a neat way to slam somebody you don’t like as you ride the crest of death and destruction.

  • Angelos

    Heeee!

    MCINTYRE: And as to your question about political, I talked to a lot of people at the Pentagon today who were very frustrated about the fact that the perception was being created that the military didn’t move fast enough. And they did it somewhat as political. They thought that part of the motivation was the critics of the administration to make the president look bad.

    And they seemed to question the motives of some of our reporters who were out there and hearing these stories from the victims about why they had so much sympathy for the victims, and not as much sympathy for the challenges that the government met in meeting this challenge.

    And I have to say thinking about that, it doesn’t really seem all that unusual that you would tend to understand the plight of the victims a little more than the bureaucrats in Washington.

    Wow, I feel so bad. I’ll start crying for the government next…

  • Angelos

    Excellent – always time for a presidential photo-op

    Look at this. These are our resources being used, in real time…

  • Catherine

    Yes, Bob, I would like 100,000 trained people at the ready with heavy machinery and supplies. Oh wait, they’re called the National Guard. Oh wait, they’re all over being someone else’s National Guard.

  • Catherine

    Can someone please tell me how it’s possible for Martin f-ing Savidge (who is completely intolerable, by the way) and an NBC news crew following Harry Connick Jr around to get to the Convention Center but they can’t get some trucks full of water? Can Michael Chertoff answer that question for me? Harry Connick Jr was beside himself on the Today Show this morning–saying that he had just driven from the Convention Center to Baton Rouge in an hour on a highway that was completely open and empty–now where’s the infrastructure problem that seems to be preventing them from getting trucks in there? What the hell is going on?

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    I can’t believe that people on this board are actually apologizing for the way officials have handled this nightmare. Had this happened in your own backyards, I doubt you’d all be as forgiving. Is GOP loyalty so strong that we dare not hold those who fail to meet the challenges that face our nation accountable for fear of losing valuable political points to the hated opposition? It is a national disgrace that we need to rely on Anderson Cooper to point out the fact that the emperor has no clothes, but thank goodness for him nonetheless.

    Surprise, surprise: you can’t gut the Federal government through a combination of war, irresponsible spending, and ideological hatred towards the very notion of social responsibility and expect someone to be there to help you when the shit truly hits the fan. This is your neoconservative utopia, people! We’ve got New Orleans drowning in the bathtub — who wants to be next?

  • dries

    anybody knows where james wolcott is on this issue? i wonder, if he still cheers for mother gea? (obscure refeence, but old readers of this blog will know)

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    Angelos: Heeee!

    I’m not wrong about this. These are some of the happiest days in Angelos’ life.

  • John T

    Gray,

    The Feds forecast the landfall of Katrina to within 50 miles. They ordered evacuation while the locals were still discussing whether to make it mandatory. From the time they were able to fly the USCG has been running helicopter rescues around the clock.

    If you recall, after Katrina passed and before the levee breaks began, many of the people who ignored the order to evacuate were congratulating themselves for knowing better than the Feds and riding it out.

    That said, I too wonder why no one was able to coordinate heli-drops of palletized water and rations to the groups of stranded.

  • Angelos

    Why does Rush LInbaugh’s girlfirend hate America?
    Daryn Kagen:
    I gotta say that was rather an odd thing to be watching. The president finally making it to the gulf coast after five days, and then spending a big chunk of time, when he could be out seeing the devastation, getting a briefing that frankly he could have gotten back at the White House, if not then, then on board Air Force One. A lot of that seemed like a political opportunity for the cameras and for the Republican governors of Mississippi and Alabama.

    General Blum of the National Guard:
    Not we’re not too late, becaue there is still plenty of suffering left.

    OMFG he can’t be serious. When even military “leaders” lose all sense of self-respect so they don’t get busted a couple ranks for speaking counter to government spin…

    Why does the Moonie Times hate America?
    Troops are finally moving into New Orleans in realistic numbers, and it’s past time. What took the government so long? The thin veneer separating civilization and chaos, which we earlier worried might collapse in the absence of swift action, has collapsed.

    Damn, when the Moonie Times starts running these editorials…

    Why does Preznit Bush hate America?
    Bush made remarks before his big helicopter adventure. He said, “results are not acceptable.” Most Americans have been thinking that for days — even while you were on vacation and playing guitar.

  • Angelos

    Sorry Carson, I should have clarified: I was laughing at you and kat.

    Plus, I was up most of the night watching this disaster unfold, so I’ve got the coffe running through my vein full speed ahaed.

  • Angelos

    Argh, and affecting my typing, obvs.

  • roger

    It is time for America to ask Mr. Bush to step down. We have had (5) years of gross incompetence. Can we survive another (3)? This is the latest example where we spend beyond our collective means and all we get is a third rate effort. The difference is that this time there is a large number of Americans caught on the TV suffering. The Bush administration can’t squelch this as they have down so successfully in Iraq. We need real leadership now and in the future. America deserves better. The buck must stop with the chief executive.

  • Fred

    Forget my previous comment about blowing up your TV. I watched Fox today and am quite impressed with their coverage.

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Bush knows full well that the American people are about to crucify the next politician who says the relief efforts are going just peachy. He’s walking on eggshells right now — his very Presidency may be on the line with albatrosses like “I don’t think anybody anticipated the breach of the levees” and “Don’t buy gas if you don’t need it” hanging around his neck…

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    On the delays. Some words from the president. The apologist-in-chief, if you will:

    Yes, I think that’s important to point out. Because when you say that they should have done this, that or the other thing first, you can look at that problem in isolation, and you can say that.

    But look at all the other things they had to deal with. I’m telling you, nobody thought this was going to happen like this. But what happened here is they escaped — New Orleans escaped Katrina. But it brought all the water up the Mississippi River and all in the Pontchartrain, and then when it started running and that levee broke, they had problems they never could have foreseen.

    And so I just think that we need to recognize right now there’s a confident effort under way. People are doing the best they can. And I just don’t think it’s the time to worry about that. We need to keep people alive and get them back to life — normal life.

    - Bill Clinton

    Note that Clinton also characterizes this as something that could not be foreseen. I don’t believe that is entirely true, whether it comes from the mouth of Bush or Clinton; but it is essentially true that these men probably did not know individually that this would happen. They, like many others, looked at the time and cost that trying to prevent the possible disaster would entail, and hoped against hope that the disaster would never happen.

    And I repeat: this is not meant as a defense of anyone, but if we want to start assigning blame and pointing fingers, there are a lot of people to start lining up. Because you’re in a comfortable den tapping on a computer laughing like a hyena at the difficulty people with the actual responsibility must shoulder makes you blameless and superior only in that you are probably even less competent and qualified to handle the enormous burden yourself.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    Sorry Carson, I should have clarified: I was laughing at you and kat.

    It matters not, Angelos. It is indicative of your mood. You have been gleeful from your first post in this thread.

  • http://www.drcookie.blogspot.com JennyD

    If you think Sartre had a vision of hell (“No Exit”) here’s a thought:

    All of the commentors on this post trapped on the roof of an apartment building in NO, with no rescuers in sight. For five days.

    Who would be the first person voted (thrown?) off the roof?

  • kat

    roger–and who the hell is your idea of “REAL LEADERSHIP”? There certainly isn’t any “REAL LEADERSHIP” on the left.
    “US Left: All Straws Clutched, Every Barrel Scraped”
    http://eurota.blogspot.com/2005/09/us-left-all-straws-clutched-every.html

  • Angelos

    Thanks for making a point for me Carson.

    As Clinton said, the storm was not as bad as predicted (in New Orleans at least), and we’re still cought with our pants down. Because of our own failures in preventive maintenance. Imagine if it HADN’T taken that right turn…

    There is plenty of blame to go around, but how much scientific and engineering analysis over the last few years was pushed aside in the name of killing FEMA, making it nothing but a name? How many funding applications for levee manitenance and improvement were denied? But there’s plenty of room for pork…

    Gleeful – no. I laugh to keep from crying, or at least to keep myself from going on a Republican-shooting spree.

    Well, well, our hero has arrived, 5 days later. And some food.

    Amazing. Let’s give them a hand, great job.

    Fuck, I’ve driven to Florida from NY in 21 hours.

    Again, the private sector, disappointed me the most: Coca-Cola with a couple 18-wheelers worth of water, and WalMart with a couple worth of non-perishables.

    The incompetence is overwhelming.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    That’s why Louisiana official have been pressing this administration for financing class 5 levees for years, Off Shore. This year, congress even slashed the funding for the preliminary study.

    That’s right, the Bush Administration has been denying the funding requests for years.

    Since 1965, in fact.

    Sp besides sealing the levee with his heat vision, Bush was supposed to go back in time and tell Lyndon Johnson to fund the cat-5 levees.

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  • Angelos

    O’Reilly, blaming the black and poor again:

    O’Reilly, on his show last night: “A lot of the people — a lot of the people who stayed wanted to do this destruction. They figured it out. And that’s — I’m not surprised.”

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Carson,

    The Big Dog can afford to be gracious, as he no doubt knows that had this shit gone down on his watch he’d already be staring at more articles of impeachment from his friends in the House of Representatives. Or worse. But if Clinton honestly thinks that no one could have possibly seen this disaster coming, then he’s as much of an idiot as anyone else parroting that awful excuse right now.

    When are we finally allowed to connect the dots? The Bush Administration apparently can’t see anything coming, yet expects our sympathy and understanding for each successive failure. Why they should get the benefit of the doubt after five years of governing without accountability is a question for the ages.

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Charlie,

    Of course, I forgot — history absolves George W. Bush of everything. Hell, Nero fiddled while Rome burned, and the Empire turned out just fine!

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Frankly, you guys have collectively a true deep problem of culture and if you do not organize yourselves to react it will run all of us to our loss. Since you are precipitating the rest of the world in the depression you have dug for one century.

    I write these words from the other side of the planet, from a small country, France Europe, which always had the claim not to act in the urgency, sometimes even while being opposed to your leaders when necessary. A small country however the majority among you did not know if not for bad reasons.
    I write to you from a country where soon, that will not go better than on your premise…

    I am shocked to learn with the public TV that the French NGOs launch a national call for donations to help your poors, those from the richest country of the world which intends to impose on the whole world its hegemony. A model which does not function, in any case, humanly, but the evidences seem not enough for you when they are daily; I sadly hope that their spectacular aspects will have more impact. I do not like the suffering, but when one suffers, it should be understood why in order to avoid to be again confronted with such a source. It is the key of the human’s evolution. A country as powerful as yours, should not forget it.

    What shocks me of course, it is not the deplorable situation in which part of your compatriots is since it is about a calamity and that your president is not ready trying to erase the destiny. No, I am literally shocked that your government and your administration prefer to call upon international solidarity rather than to pre-empt the products of the financial speculation which is the trademark of your economy.

    I am shocked that your large and rich companies do not precipitate on their wallets. I am shocked that those among you who believe still to be able to survive in this system do not anticipate this type of social catastrophes which are not that misent in obviousness by this extraordinary crisis. I am shocked that your funds of pension ruin human beings everywhere in the world, depriving them of their last dignity, that of work.

    I am shocked that non glad to ridicule the most primary human values, some dare to worry about the consequences of this cataclysm on the price of oil.

    I am against solidarity because it signs the disappearance of fraternity. Your culture is based on solidarity but it ridicules the most elementary bases of fraternity. Solidarity is functional, fraternity is tribal. With forcing all to rationalize, you to go to push the world to be reproduced by cloning and damned, it will be the end of ours singularities, our humanity.

    I beg you, I launch you a call. Save the human being. Prefer it from the economic machine. Work must serve the human being, not to control it. I beg you, open the eyes, open your arms, organize yourselves, make get along. I do not lead you to the revolution, I do not believe in it. I simply would like you to resist valiantly re-imposing the human one in the centre of your organization.

    Here is, I lime pits sincerely these poor anonymous human’s lives whose media exploit the image to maintain always more the sensational one. But I lime pits as much humanity if your institutions do not mature finally. Help yourselves, help your institutions, help humanity.

    fraternally,

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  • Angelos

    The world reacts.

    And more…

    And my favorite:
    One feed of about five minutes or so in length showed George W. Bush walking down a road–in Mississippi, I’m guessing–and greeting a pair of survivors, a woman and (seemingly) her daughter. The mother was nearly hysterical as she described losing her boyfriend. The president hugged them, encouraged them to leave and go to a shelter. When the woman persisted, the president hugged her again. Shutters could be heard snapping, and no doubt the pictures are already hitting the wire.

    And here were his parting words of counsel, comfort, leadership, and hope to this absolutely distraught woman, picked up clearly on the satellite feed:

    “All right. Hang in there.”

  • whodat

    “I am shocked to learn with the public TV that the French NGOs launch a national call for donations to help your poors, those from the richest country of the world which intends to impose on the whole world its hegemony. ”

    Are you stoned? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_France

    Let’s see we have helped you repeatedly throughout history, with our blood and money (which you didn’t payback voluntarily) and you sit over there appalled. Without us you’d have nowhere to sit.

    So you beg our big corporations to help out, but you don’t want to help. Totally humanitarian.

  • Hen o’ the woods

    Carson MisFire: (in a whining, snivelling voice) “The *biggest* scandal is that the levees required to protect New Orleans from a category 4 or 5 would be a massive project that would have taken at least 30 years to build. Get that? 30 freaking years.”

    Gee, any coicidence that you found this piece of nonsense at a notorious pro-Bush facist rag? My kid’s nursery school class could build an appropriate levee faster using dirt and erector sets. In any event, if this blather were true, you can bet Halliburton and Bechtel would have jumped at the opportunity to launch a 30 year-long fraud-friendly project and climbed immediately into bed with the famously inept US Army Corp of Engineers. Why defend these criminals unless you are one?

    Exterminating (or reeducating) assholes is not about hatred or assigning blame, it is about common decency and respect for all living things (except assholes) on this planet. Racist, nationalist, economic driven mass murderers like Pol Pot, Mao, Mussolini, Hitler, Karl Rove, etc.) are big time assholes too (to borrow from MIA Prick Cheney). I’m simply suggesting that if every racist/ignorant/greedy subhuman disappeared off the face of the planet, the world would be a far better place. And please, don’t attribute my views to any partisan agenda, it just so happens that all Republicans happen to fall into the subhuman category (as do many Democrats, including most in Congress and Clinton too). I wouldn’t shed a tear if a suitcase nuke went off in Hollywood either. A tad heavy handed? Perhaps. Against the grain of my natural humanitarian impulses? Conceded. But decent folk around the world have been raped and slaughtered directly and/or indirectly by BushPig Inc., and a mass extermination of vermin bent on destroying the planet would be an ultimate act of charity and goodness. Don’t forget that my modest proposal suggests that not every asshole would necessarily have to be exterminated. Many could opt for reeducation and a life of hard labor where they could actually contribute to society.

    And just an aside, wouldn’t you think Bush could lose the shit-eating grin just for a minute while he’s talking with people who’s lives have been destroyed by the hurricane and his Administration’s pathetic response?

    Have a blessed day!

  • Ravo

    Spoken like a true jihadst.

    …the spot where the levee broke, had been upgrade…nothing further could have been done on it at that spot.

  • Lou

    The only shame is that for some people no tragedy is to big to politisize. Obviously President Bush is the only person in the world responsible for the people in NO. He certainly should have known that a CAT1 huricane would all of a sudden become a CAT5. And there was never a doubt that it would hit NO. And of course we could have had all the emergency stuff ready in NO, oh, and in Mississippi, and oh yea, in Alabama too, did I mention Florida. And of coarse Bush should have trained those NO policemen better. But you know where he really failed was in not teaching those people who stole, raped, and killed to be be nicer.

  • http://www.feedwriter.com Greg Burton

    Ravo, unfotunately, that is not the case. Repairs had not been completed on the levee where it broke. Repairs had been delayed due to buget considerations over the last two years, and the work was way behind the planned schedule.

    On Tuesday, after the collapse, the NO mayor told us that despite an agreement from the Feds, State, and City that filling the breach in the levee was the highest priority, the lift copter was diverted to rescue. Work on filling the breach was not actually started until yesterday.

    Eileen points out that we had dropped food and it wasn’t reported. To my knowledge, the first food drops into NO happened yesterday evening, and they weren’t sufficient. I don’t know that anything would have been.

    More to the point, I think, is that 1.7 million people were evacuated from a major hurricane area this year, and very few lives were lost. How and why a poor country like Cuba could pull this off, and we can’t, is a legitimate question, regardless of one’s politics.

  • Rachel

    Stop complaining about big corporations not doing anything. Just because you don’t hear about it doesn’t mean it’s not happening. I don’t suppose you know that GE gave $1 million a few days ago. Then the employees collectively donated $1 million. Which was then matched by another million by GE. Then they added $5 million more to the kitty. And also pledged medical supplies, generators, manpower, etc etc. Anyway, as for Coke, do you think they have 4 million bottles of water sitting around, along with ways to load/transport/unload said water? I really don’t know, but I doubt it. I also doubt any of the large companies are sitting around doing nothing.

    All the donation efforts are a waste though, big company or individual, without someone to organize and plan. The local government, FEMA, etc seem to have really dropped the ball on that.

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Re. whodat:

    Are you stoned? check it by yourself : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bretton_Woods_Conference

    I persist, you realy have a problem of culture… and education…

    At least, I’ve never said that I didn’t want to help, I said I was shocked that your companies, your economic system, those for whome you give your lives every day, didn’t propose immediatly to help…

    Don’t play drama with such a subject please. Even don’t play nationalisms or ideologisms. Let us be worthy please.

  • Ravo

    Right on Lou…

    It’s disgusting how the left is looting this disaster for very cheap political reasons.

    No amount of money can guarantee the risk-free existence so craved by the US Left.

    And, let’s not forget that the levee system protecting New Orleans belongs to the people of Louisiana, not the feds. It protects one city; it isn’t an interstate system such as the ones built along the Mississippi. Why didn’t Louisiana fund its own improvements? What have they done about the situation except wait for the rest of the country to fund them?

    Note New Orleans has been governed by African American leftists for 25 yrs. Hurricane Katrina has made vivid the civilizational collapse they have long tried to conceal.

    http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=8684

    You’re right, somehow the left will find a way to blame Bush for that as well.

  • Ravo

    Greg, I just heard a statement made on the radio to the contrary.

    There is also an article on the efforts for the levees spanning years here:
    http://www.captainsquartersblog.com/mt/archives/005362.php

  • Liam

    CLARA: YOU SAIDC I am shocked that those among you who believe still to be able to survive in this system do not anticipate this type of social catastrophes which are not that misent in obviousness by this extraordinary crisis. I am shocked that your funds of pension ruin human beings everywhere in the world, depriving them of their last dignity, that of work.

    I am shocked that non glad to ridicule the most primary human values, some dare to worry about the consequences of this cataclysm on the price of oil.

    “As Englishman, whose nation who faught against Nazis, compared with yours, that sucked up to it, a nation of apppeasement and cowardice I would kindly France to GO FUCK ITSELF……..

  • Linda Edwards

    Ravo, it’s the Army Corp of Engineers responsibility to maintain the levee system, not the state of Louisiana. It’d be nice if you knew what the hell you were ranting about.

    Gosh, did you think it was Florida’s responsibility to take care of itself last year after their hurricanes. Remember how quickly everything got mobilized and people taken care of in Florida? During an election year. For the prez’s brother. In a swing state.

    I sure didn’t hear you bitching then.

    Why wasn’t this handled with the same degree of urgency? Or competence?

  • http://www.agoyandhisblog.com/?p=85 goy

    - I said I was shocked that your companies, your economic system, those for whome you give your lives every day, didn’t propose immediatly to help…

    Clara – What makes you think they didn’t?? Promises by Americans to help other Americans are always UNDERSTOOD here. We don’t feel the need to broadcast them over the airwaves and brag about it. We just do it. The issues you and all the other grousing, second-guessing, Friday-morning Quarterbacks here are struggling with are the concepts of TIME, SCALE and LOGISTICS.

    One person can drive from NY to FL in 21 hours. BFD. 10,000 people? 20,000? 50,000? Now throw downed trees and power lines, flooded and washed-out roadways, collapsed infrastructure and desperation into the mix. Now throw the last fifty years’ history of recovery from hurricanes on top of that. For instance, people have always emerged from the Superdome after a storm to return home. OOPS!! Not this time! Got any idea how completely that changed the landscape? The New Orleans city government obviously didn’t. And they are a perfect example. Do you think they would have put those people there if they’d KNOWN how bad things would get? Why does Nagin get a free pass and Bush is castigated?? Double standards, that’s why.

    Everywhere I look, everyone I talk to – here in NEW ENGLAND – there are efforts under way to HELP.

    The most important thing to remember here is that this process of HELPING started *as soon as the magnitude of the problem became known*. That took longer than it should have primarily for one, single reason: New Orleans’ utter lack of preparedness for this catastrophe. Official communication into and out of the city – thanks to the complete lack of a disaster preparedness plan – was nonexistent. As such, the problem for the survivors got worse than their city government hoped, and the real magnitude of the problem there wasn’t truly clear outside the area until Tue. or Wed. The destruction between the places that have the resources to help and the places that need the help is mind-boggling. Show us your detailed plan on how that was supposed to be dealt with in less time than it has taken to do so. Then let’s talk. Otherwise, well – you know…

    Anyone who claims things should have happened sooner or better or faster had better be able to back that up with details, otherwise it’s just more partisan BS aimed at someone they’ve been trained by their media to hate.

  • Liam

    Good on you Goy.

    I am a Brit. France did not save the Enlightentment. It did not save freedom, shit you may not be perfect so fucking what, your nation tries.

    Stop doubting yourselves. what a nation. bless you all

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Liam: so English…

    For those fullish who still believing that US take a free part to the 2WW, please read this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_plan Just for you to read correctly the pictures (text could seem too long for your but even if English is not my mothertong, I n ew few little things about European history). For those who are not afraid trying to find some additional written information, have a look at what you call the “chicago boys” crossing the reference with “uno”…

    Rachel: thinks for this good new.

    I still not understanding that your government or its representatives have not evacuated those poors knowing they didn’t have cars to escape. If I would be cynical I would think that a poor black american alive represents less costs’ risks than a rich white tourist, even when it’s about repatriating their bodies…

    Please, don’t think I’m saying that with pleasure. Countrary to Tsunami, Katarina was a predicted event…

  • http://www.agoyandhisblog.com/?p=85 goy

    - your government

    Clara, you can dispense with the racist innuendo.

    We have multiple levels of government: Federal, State and Local. The responsibility for evacuating the residents of New Orleans lay with that city’s government, and would have been part of their disaster preparedness program – IF they had one.

    Only Ray Nagin knows why he didn’t evacuate the poor, young, elderly, infirm and others, whether they were black, white, green or Sicilian. If you want answers, I suggest you start with him. But keep in mind – he’s very busy these days criticizing the federal government for taking longer than a few days to fix the problem he created through years of denial.

  • http://www.feedwriter.com Greg Burton

    Ravo – what I’ve read is this: “The levee, as designed, might not have held back the surge from a direct Class 5 hit, but it certainly would not have crumbled on Monday night from saturation and scour erosion following a glancing blow from a Class 3. The failure was in a spot that had just been rebuilt, not yet compacted, not planted, and not armed (hardened with rock/concrete). The project should have been done two years ago, but the federal gov’t diverted 80% of the funding to Iraq. Other areas had settled by a few feet from their design specs, and the money to repair them was diverted to Iraq.

    The NO paper raised hell about this”

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Goy: Thank you too for those info. I don’t doubt that people who are able to are helping. I know now that companies as well as employees are too. I know from 9/11 that your people is able of a great solidarity in major crises, certainly more than mine would be. I also know that your public services are sometimes not so well financed that they might be for the public security, ealth, education. Of course, I know I don’t know anything, I just know what medias agree to let me know…

    So, what I’m saying is that institutional responsibles seems dramatically out in this human drama.

    Please, don’t think I’m pushing you or provocating by arrogance. This is not my purpose. Maybe my controle of your language doesn’t help… Sorry if I hurted.

  • Liam

    Liam: so English…ahhhhh reveal your prejudice…….what is my name….ooooooppppppppssss……nope———My history is Irish, I love France for many reasons but I hate it for its duplicity. France could not hope to be as multicultural as the USA. That is why your revolution ended in slaughter and why the US has grown.,,,,,

  • http://www.agoyandhisblog.com/?p=85 goy

    - I don’t know anything, I just know what medias agree to let me know.

    You are not the only one in this predicament. ;-)

    I submit to you that this is part of the reason for the anti-American sentiment we deal with both here and abroad. The media – primarily to gain advertising dollars, but also to push their pet agendas (right, left, insane, whatever) – editorialize and distort the reality on which they “report” beyond recognition. This week their project is to make President Bush responsible for Katrina and her aftermath. And so it goes…

    Thank you for your thoughts.

  • Ravo

    Linda

    Why wasn’t this handled with the same degree of urgency? Or competence?

    In my opinion Florida and New York had a Mayor and Governor more up to such a task.

    Plus Florida didn’t have the same “retained water” problems.

    We are all armchair generals here, and none of us have the whole picture.

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Liam: by so English, I meant that traditionaly English are much known for them selfcontrol than what you shown. By my side, I’m Portuguese. What you maybe call duplicity regarding France can be read in their ability to never stop criticising with a strong emphase on their ability to autocritise themselves. Maybe it can help some times, maybe be the countrary. What I have statuated till now is that this capacity is positive when it is about long term anticipation and negative when it is about acting. French talk a lot, they theorise a lot to and when it is time for action, they still theorising most of the time…

    At least, regarding French capacity to manage multicultural values, my very own experience is an European one. I quite fluently talk 4 foreign languages. I’m not sure English spokers have the same need/curiosity… Regarding revolutions, thanks France to have help English revolutionars to get free and recognized by England. And of course, thanks England for the industrial revolution, so human…

    Whatever, regarding wars and revolutions, I would like to stress that all those events are ALWAYS drove by political or financial interests. Doesn’t matter the name of the country who have the advantage at this time.

    Goy: thanks for your indulgency. I keep working on my knowledge.

  • tonynoboloney

    I am appalled, I am having a hard time responding without breaking my rule of “feeding the trolls”. I cannot fathom the response by the MSM, bloggers, politicians, and finger pointers.

    In the days leading up to the worst natural disaster ever to hit this country, (1 million homeless, 5 million without power, 90,000 sq. miles affected, est. 20,000 missing), it became evident we were about to experience the “mother of all storms” on the morning of Aug 29. On Aug. 27, our president declared a state of emergency for Louisianna, and advised the governor of that state to begin imediate evacuation of New Orleans and its environs. At that time the president ordered the deployment of the USS Bataan which arrived on the 30th along with the USNS Artic which arrived on the 31st, also ordered for deployment were a whole cottillion (sp?) of ampibious assault ships too numerous to name. Included with the deployment of military equipment, 11,000 Air National Guard personel were called to duty, 7,200 active troops, along with an additional 10,000 National Guardsmen from surrounding states. FEMA and other federal agencies ordered to duty 10 search and rescue teams, 23 medical disaster response teams, 1700 trucks of water and food, add to that 390 trucks sent by the Dept. of Trans. carrying water, food and supplies, not to mention the 100′s of volunteer fire, police and first responders teams with ambulances and equiptment from all over the country.

    This disaster struck with a vegence on the morning of Aug.29, and by late in the day it became apparent that the levees would not hold. An estimated 25,000 refugees sought shelter in the Superdome, their numbers would swell to more than 60,000 in the ensuing days. Looting, snipers, near riots, and roaming gangs of armed thugs all had to be contended with. Medical personel worked around the clock in flooded hospitals with little or no food, water or power trying to save lives. IN LESS THAN 100 HOURS after the most devastating storm ever to hit America most of the refugees at the “dome” were moved to other quarters, and the rest were recieving food, water and medical assistance. IN LESS THAN 100 HOURS hundreds if not thousands were plucked from their roof tops and out of the flood waters. IN LESS THAN 100 HOURS this country had mobilized the largest humanitarian rescue in history.

    Congress has just today appropriated 10.5 Billion dollars towards the relief effort. The work of the search and rescue, reconstruction, and the re-building of shattered lives has just begun it will most certainly take months, probably years before we see normalcy for those affected in this tragedy. It will cost all of us much time & treasure before this is done.

    I am proud to be an American today, not ashamed or making appologies for not doing enough, not moving quickly enough. I do not feel the need to castigate my leaders for being insensitive or question their motives or intentions. I will be prouder still as through the coming months billions upon billions of dollars will pour into this devastated area to these unfortunate victims through our hard earned taxes and especially given freely by the people of this great country.

  • Ravo

    http://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2005_08_28_digbysblog_archive.html#112561353125592699

    Clara…re: do we value the lives of the poor?

    Working people on vacation in New Orleans were left stranded and abandoned when the buses they had just paid for to come get them were taken and used to serve the poor folks you are worrying about.

    Feel happier now?

  • Ravo

    Clara…

    P.S. :-) Give up reading major media. It twists and spins and misleads.
    It’s demise is imminent.

  • kat

    The French could not even stop hundreds of old people from dying from heat, let alone help in this catastrophe. Screw the French.

  • http://www.drcookie.blogspot.com JennyD

    I’m trying to understand why citizens began shooting at rescue workers, and otherwise harming those who might help. Also, why (if the stories are true) victims beat each other, raped each other, etc. Why did victims behave so badly?

    This is kind of off the track a little, but someone comapred the tsuanami and hurricane today. And they said there are parallels in terms of people left homeless (not in overall numbers, but in context). In both cases, the poor were hardest hit.

    In the US, though, the poor don’t live in huts and total squalor. They have televisions, and access to inexpensive food, and other things. That’s unlike the nations hit by the tsunami, where the poor live without these extras.

    Might that explain the stress level of the US victims, and their behavior?

  • Eileen

    Thanks, Liam.

    And thanks, Tonynobaloney. Add to your information the fact that the storm continued to rage throughout the Eastern U.S. for several days (impacting how many states ultimately? – and don’t forget FLA, either), complete with tornados which caused their own destruction, power outages, downed trees, power lines and debris. Add to that the fact that NO’s airport was temporarily out of commission and needed to be cleared of debris. And on and on. All through the region, life saving efforts were required on a massive scale. I read that FOUR MILLION PEOPLE were either displaced or directly impacted by Katrina.

    Add to that that ‘supposedly’ the dome was stocked with food and water, so none of those people “didn’t have food or water for 4 days” as is repeated ad nauseum by our devoted MSM. Add to that the fact that FEMA WASN’T EVEN ADVISED of the existence of thousands at the Convention Center until YESTERDAY. Who didn’t advise them? The democratic mayor who fled his own city, all city officials, the democratic governor and local emergency management personnel of all stripes in the state of LA.

    My sister reported that that section of the levee had just been COMPLETED with great hoopla and fanfare in NO. If what Greg reports is true, even *more* reason for the democratic mayor and governor to make DAMN SURE those people were evacuated as a category 5 approached.

    But it’s so much *more fun* for the terrorist taqiyya talking types who frequent this site, along with their rabid Bush bashing brethren (who pat each other on the backs with glee), to spread their favorite U.S./Bush is the great Satan meme. And the MSM pushes their same ‘ole, destructive, anti-American/Bush bashing agenda down our throats in the midst of the greatest natural disaster this country has ever known.

    Chris Matthews’s opening line just now: “Why wasn’t somebody on top of this?” Gag. The naysayers are truly the most destructive group of all. Bitch, moan, whine and complain. Tear us down. Show the same people crying 80 trillion times for good measure. Don’t report – until you can’t otherwise avoid it – ANY of the measures taken by the Federal government to rescue and save literally hundreds of thousands immediately after the winds died down across an area the size of Great Britain.

    This week your bile is spilling over the top, just like the toxic soup which now fills NO.

  • http://www.agoyandhisblog.com/?p=85 goy

    - I’m trying to understand why citizens began shooting at rescue workers, and otherwise harming those who might help. Also, why (if the stories are true) victims beat each other, raped each other, etc. Why did victims behave so badly?

    Jenny, this might provide some clues: http://tinyurl.com/7gzju

    My psychologist wife tells me that an event like this does not change the basic nature of a person, it magnifies that basic nature.

    It would seem that a significant number of New Orleans’ criminal element remained behind along with those who didn’t have transportation, when everyone else was evacuated, for what are now obvious reasons. This also explains (in addition to the unsuitability of the roads into N.O.) why privately contracted delivery vehicles with supplies were prevented from entering the area before the National Guard arrived to restore order.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    And yes, BOB, Americans pay taxes so that this kind of situation never happens. I cannot believe this is our country. The government should have been mobilized and ready to go on MONDAY!

    Uh, Marie, that would be the day before the levee broke.

  • http://www.agoyandhisblog.com/?p=85 goy

    A reality check for the “reality-based” among us”

    http://tinyurl.com/a8pzt

    ” Q.2. Why did the levees fail?

    A.2. What failed were actually floodwalls, not levees. This was caused by overtopping which caused scouring, or an eating away of the earthen support, which then basically undermined the wall.

    These walls and levees were designed to withstand a fast moving category 3 hurricane. Katrina was a strong 4 at landfall, and conditions exceeded the design.

    Q.3. Why only Category 3 protection?

    A.3. That is what we were authorized to do. “

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    What you are saying is very sound. But, I really believe, supply drops since Monday, into the Super Dome and other areas would have prevented the folks from rioting from hunger, thirst, and desperation thus cutting off help for awhile. I went through Hurricane Andrew, all you want is your life preserved and a bottle of water-food is even a side issue-you stay alive out of fear.

    Kabri, what you get in that situation is riots as people fight for the supplies, and deaths as the pallets land on people.

    And no, you can’t fly in right away, and no, when you spend 100 hours clearing the highways you can’t get through instantly, and when a caravan of aid starts from a thousand miles away it takes 20 hours to get there.

    Sometimes this reality thing just sucks, you know? but the Government can’t change the laws of physics either.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    One question: What does it take to get water to the convention center? Start there. Tht’s what we’re talking about: Calculate how many bottles of water could fit on one of your buses.

    Handily enough, people need four liters of water a day and that makes it about 9 pounds per person per day. A bus load of people (70) weighs about 7 tons, let’s say 10 tons is the load limit.

    That’s water for 2222 people. For a day.

    As a matter of fact, the NG had brought in both food and water.

    And the roads were impassible for a couple of days after the levee broke.

    And dammit, there were Chinooks and Coastie copters landing there on Wednesday.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    Frankly, you guys have collectively a true deep problem of culture and if you do not organize yourselves to react it will run all of us to our loss. Since you are precipitating the rest of the world in the depression you have dug for one century.

    This from the country that lost 10,000 people to a hot spell.

  • Linda Edwards

    Ravo,

    FEMA Mission
    DISASTER. It strikes anytime, anywhere. It takes many forms — a hurricane, an earthquake, a tornado, a flood, a fire or a hazardous spill, an act of nature or an act of terrorism. It builds over days or weeks, or hits suddenly, without warning. Every year, millions of Americans face disaster, and its terrifying consequences.

    On March 1, 2003, the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) became part of the U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS). FEMA’s continuing mission within the new department is to lead the effort to prepare the nation for all hazards and effectively manage federal response and recovery efforts following any national incident. FEMA also initiates proactive mitigation activities, trains first responders, and manages the National Flood Insurance Program and the U.S. Fire Administration.

    From FEMA’s own website at http://www.fema.gov/about/

    Did you get the part where is says “lead the effort to prepare the nation for all hazards (see previous paragraph for definition of hazards, which includes HURRICANES) and EFFECTIVELY MANAGE federal response and recover efforts following any national incident”.

    Guess what Ravo. That’s what FEMA is supposed to be there for. People in NO pay their taxes just like the people in NY and Florida do, and they should expect they would receive the same.

    NO infrastructure was destroyed by a disaster that occured due Bush’s budget cuts. Just earlier this year Bush turned down the Army Corp of Engineer’s request for levee money. NO only has a police force of 1500. Just how in the hell do you think the mayor was going to be able to make the resources he would have needed magically appear, especially considering 80% of the city (including jails and police stations) were under water.

    I should think any logical, reasonable, sane, rational person (guess that excludes you) would figure out that there was no way in hell’s half acres that NO would be able to scratch the surface in tackling this problem.

    You weren’t spewing when FEMA took care of Florida and NY. You didn’t tell them “you’re on your own”. You’re only making excuses why NO has been treated differently. Why is that?

    Frankly, from reading your bullshit from the past few days, it’s very obvious why. You don’t hide your bigotry well (are you even trying?).

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Charlie: Unfortunately, I’m no more talking for died people (RIP). What happened in France during summer 03 is as scandalous even more than what NO is living according it was not a sudent event but a period. I don’t want to respond to fanatics. We all have interest (individualy as well as collectivly) in analysing fairly this kind of situations which by my own, often are the result of a technical treatment of human’s needs by trying to optimise the level of guaranty with the level of investments necessary.

    I maybe don’t understand all what you’re talking about but am realy surprised to learn that your country don’t have air tankers (sorry Im not a specialist of militarian vocabulary).

    100 Hours –when you have a baby crying for food or water surrounded by people turned animals as so they are no longer considered as human by the society– is impossible to understand. This situation of crise doesn’t depend on the criminal background of the area or the local policy past involvement or not. You’re a nation, a federa one right, but you all are from the same country. I just can’t face that your central government is more qualified or that it pretends to be able to take care of out edges interests than he is to take care of its owns…

    Don’t think I’m provocative, sure I’m surprised, feeling scandalised and maybe I think (so easy, so reassuring) that this kind of dismissing from our authorities would cost them power and maybe more. But I still trying to understand fairly your situation. For you to know, I don’t use English in my day to day life but my level of concern is so that I am reading as much testimonys and local articles as I can. And you all seem very prolific. Thanks.

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    So let’s recap the apologists’ arguments, shall we?

    1. Eileen: “Criticizing the relief effort is just more Bush bashing, unless Bush himself does it, in which case… er… um…”

    2. Tonynobaloney: “I’m so proud that it took ONE HUNDRED HOURS to get drinking water to infants and the elderly — the ones that weren’t already dead, I mean.”

    3. Charlie: “When in doubt, blame the French.”

    4. Carsonfire: “See? I told you I’d find a way to work Clinton into this one.”

    5. Goy: “Why blame the rescuers when it’s much easier to blame the victims?”

    6. Kat: “I can’t blame either the gays or the Muslims in this thread, can I? Well then I’ve got nothing!”

    7. Ravo: “Excuse me while I go burn some crosses.”

    Lovely. Remind me not to experience a natural disaster with you guys at the helm!

  • http://ruthcalvo Ruth

    JE:

    Forget the causists, get out there and help. Appreciation to your solypsis, but its time to get beyond the nonsense and go beyond rhetoric.

  • Eileen

    Remind yourself that you don’t speak for me, or even accurately summarize my comments.

    Why don’t you run up to the post above and read ronni’s comments. Your time would be better spent.

  • Ravo

    Linda, The Mayor should have had the National Guard ready to go, (HE is the one that needs to originate that) and those people should have been made to evacuate on all those school buses that were left to flood. Take a note from how Texas handled it…they moved everyone in time…with school buses and whatever else they could get.

    To quote another poster here:

    “The Mayor of New Orleans had and still has the primary responsibility for the safety and emergency needs of his city. Others may not have performed at the level those posting feel adequate but the realities are:
    The Mayor’s Emergency Plan – Failed
    The Mayor’s Evacuation Plan – Failed
    The Mayor’s Police Department – Failed
    The Mayor’s Fire Department – Failed
    The Mayor’s Communication – Failed
    The Mayor’s Leadership – Failed
    And now the Mayor goes on radio and television and extolls others to “Get off their Asses”. Mr. Mayor it is almost impossible to determine if others are getting off their asses when you clearly have your head planted squarely up your own ass.

    As trucks roll and Gurdsmen bring law and order, the Mayor and others need to do some serious self evaluation and accept their own failures and stop berating those who are coming to help them.”

    As far as bigot? Yeah, I’m bigoted toward people like you LInda Edwards…whatever color you are..white as snow or other…who
    play the race card at a time like this..you are despicable.

  • Ravo

    FROM ANOTHER POSTER: New Orleans voted DOWN to provide for levees in a program the Feds match…perferring to spend it on the superdome instead.

    I’m tired of all the “Bush diverted money from the levee projects” The real truth is that the city of New Orleans voted down a property tax increase for levee repair (and passed one for superdome maintenance).
    Levee repair is a matching funds project-the state pays a portion and federal govt kicks in the rest. That’s how Corps of Engineer projects are paid for. Louisiana didn’t qualify for the funding because the voters chose not to. I guess they decided to take their chances and ended up losing.

  • LanceThruster

    Every picture of a body of someone that died because Bush’s disaster (non)relief was a disaster should have the caption:

    - George W. Bush’s “Culture of Life”.

    These people were not in a brain damaged vegetative state but rather individuals that desperately wanted to live. But because their government failed them in so many ways, they died for lack of basic needs (food, water, shelter, medicine, protection from thugs). Bush and Co. should be arrested for criminal negligence. There was never any sense of urgency for his misadministration to act in a timely and effective manner. There is (even more) blood on his hands and on everyone’s who assisted him in back to back election thefts.

  • Angelos

    “So let’s recap the apologists’ arguments, shall we?”

    Jersey, what a post.

    This was a failure of government at every level.

    But people will always apologize for the R, not the D.

    Hmmm…

  • Eileen

    THE JIHADISTS ARE HERE IN FULL FORCE.

  • Pingback: This is Not the Republic of Nice » Blog Archive » Disaster Preparedness

  • Gray

    Rove, erh, sry, Ravo, ‘The Mayor should have had the National Guard ready to go’? For god’s sake, use your head first and search for information on topics you don’t know anything about before posting nonsense like this.

    I’m a german citizen and even I know that US mayors have NO authority over the National Guard, not even over the members who are inhabitants of the city. That’s ‘no’ in the meaning of zero, nil, nothing. Doing a quick google I found the information that not even the mayor of Washington DC has authority over ‘his’ National guard units:
    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/arng-dc.htm

    Ravo, you’re either a totally ignorant blabbermouth or a spinmeister. But be beware that most here are not stupid enough to fall for your obvious misinformation.

  • Grray

    Rove, erh, sry, Ravo, ‘The Mayor should have had the National Guard ready to go’? For god’s sake, use your head first and search for information on topics you don’t know anything about before posting nonsense like this.

    I’m a german citizen and even I know that US mayors have NO authority over the National Guard, not even over the members who are inhabitants of the city. That’s ‘no’ in the meaning of zero, nil, nothing. Doing a quick google I found the information that not even the mayor of Washington DC has authority over ‘his’ National guard units:
    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/arng-dc.htm

    Ravo, you’re either a totally ignorant blabbermouth or a spinmeister. But be beware that most here are not stupid enough to fall for your obvious misinformation.

  • Grray

    ‘FEMA’s mission remains: to lead America to prepare for, prevent, respond to and recover from disasters with a vision of “A Nation Prepared.” ‘

    And now take a look what support FEMA officials were giving the mayors of the cities in Katrina’s path:

    ‘ “With the eye of Hugo over my City Hall, literally, I said to a FEMA official, ‘What’s the main bit of advice you can give me?’ and he said, ‘You need to make sure you’re accounting for all your expenses,” Mayor Riley recalled. ‘
    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/09/03/national/nationalspecial/03voices.html?hp&ex=1125806400&en=701f5b453c07f07a&ei=5094&partner=homepage

  • Faramin

    Kat and Eileen,

    See, even a disaster such as this which kills perhaps thousands of people in you own country, doesn’t make you think properly.

    You don’t care about the suffering people. Do you? Or better to say, you do care only to the point that nobody criticizes rich ass Bush. Have you guys sworn to cheer for the incompetent Bush and his gang in any condition? If that’s the case, that’s not loyalty. That’s idiocy. Then, what is the difference between you and those who support other type of fundamentalist leaders in any condition? Believe me, not much.

    By the way, you have no idea how much you’re making yourselves sound laughable.

  • Grray

    “I think it puts into question all of the Homeland Security and Northern Command planning for the last four years, because if we can’t respond faster than this to an event we saw coming across the Gulf for days, then why do we think we’re prepared to respond to a nuclear or biological attack?”
    Newt Gingrich

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Way to not answer the question, Eileen — how is it that you and a handful of diehard apologists keep insisting that there’s been nothing wrong with the relief efforts when your own President disagrees with you?

    You’ve been hung out to dry on this one, I’m afraid. Time to slink away quietly from the argument and hope no one remembers that you actually tried to defend this fiasco that makes 9/11 look like a country picnic in retrospect.

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Tonynobaloney,

    Tsunami relief to Aceh mobilized in less than 48 hours, and we’re talking the third world here. Hell, our own aircraft carriers had gotten involved over there well before the 100 hour mark, and you’re trying to tell me that you’re proud it took just as long to get relief to a city in the Lower 48?

    How much Kool-Aid are you going to drink for these turkeys running the show?

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Eileen,

    Get your irrelevant Islamophobic swill out of this thread. It’s worked since 9/11 but something tells me that you’re going to have to find someone new to hate in order to keep the limelight on you and your kind.

    (May I suggest the director of FEMA? Or the man who appointed him, perhaps.)

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Note New Orleans has been governed by African American leftists for 25 yrs. Hurricane Katrina has made vivid the civilizational collapse they have long tried to conceal.

    If only N.O. had known the gentle but firm hand of a white Republican, this whole catastrophe could have been avoided…

    …just ask Biloxi mayor A.J. Holloway!

  • http://thealguy.blogspot.com/ Al Hill
  • Mommie Dearest

    If Bush really wanted to make this right, he’d cut of “Brownie”‘s head with a rusty spoon and then swallow a cup of bleach. It’s time to slaughter the pigs.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    JerseyExile: When are we finally allowed to connect the dots? The Bush Administration apparently can’t see anything coming, yet expects our sympathy and understanding for each successive failure.

    Mandatory evacuation ordered for New Orleans

    Gov. Kathleen Blanco, standing beside the mayor at a news conference, said President Bush called and personally appealed for a mandatory evacuation for the low-lying city, which is prone to flooding.

    The hate flying out of the mouths and other orifices of the left right now are based on some real problems that everyone is going to agree are real failures; but a greater portion of the left’s complaints are based on the old reliables, rumor-mongering and hearsay.

    Yesterday I heard lots of people on the left ferociously rumorizing at each other that Bush is so arrogant that he’s turning down all offers for help! Today, on a leftist radio station, I heard two women discussing the fact that Bush is so ill-prepared for this that he’s having to go around and beg help from other nations! (They cited this as just another reason why Bush should be impeached, but then they wrung their hands over the idea of a President Cheney who, even now, is behind the scenes doing “evil things”)

    As usual, the left can’t even get their vicious, heart-wrenching accusations straight. More coordination, guys! I sometimes read leftists complaining that they can’t figure out how “wingnuts” get their “talking points” so fast. See, it’s not so hard for sensible people to come to similar conclusions independently when they use fact, not fiction, as their guide. If your only interest is braying tons of things that you don’t even know are true or not, but *feel* must be true because you *know* the other guy is evil, no amount of faxing each other is going to keep you coordinated.

    As we go forward, there will be hearings, and likely some heads will roll over the *real* errors and failures. But the fantasies of the left will constantly shift and spin to the point that most people will recognize it for what it is… again.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    That news release was dated August 28th, by the way. But, please, let’s not let facts get in the way of our red hot hate.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    Of course, I forgot — history absolves George W. Bush of everything. Hell, Nero fiddled while Rome burned, and the Empire turned out just fine!

    Goddamn morons. Look, at least try to act like a grownup, would you? The levee project to completely protect New Orleans had been talked about, and turned down, in 1965. Doesn’t it strike you as just a touch unrealistic to blame Bush for that?

    The project to do the levees would take 30 years. Bush has been President for 5. Doesn’t it strike you as unrealistic to blame Bush for the levees not having been built?

    Yeah, New Orleans wasn’t evacuated — but Bush declared a disaster on Saturday, and then had to beg the LA pols to make the evacuation mandatory — and then some large number of people didn’t evacuate because they couldn’t find transportation — while something like 500 NO city buses (200+ school buses, 200 city buses) sat neatly parked in their parking lots. And you think that’s Bush’s fault?

    Here, let’s think about this for a moment: what could possibly have been done? Should Bush have declared an emergency, federalized the National Guard, overruled the Governor and the Mayor, declared martial law in New Orleans, commandeered all available buses, and forced the population in the low-lying parts of NO out at gun point?

    That’s what it would have taken. Of course, if he had done that, the same fucking idiots would have been complaining about an impending coup about 20 minutes later.

    Do you really want the President to be able to take over from a Democrat Governor and Mayor like that?

    Or have you just lost your fucking senses?

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    If only N.O. had known the gentle but firm hand of a white Republican, this whole catastrophe could have been avoided…
    …just ask Biloxi mayor A.J. Holloway!

    Actually, I’ve got friends in Biloxi and Slidell, and they aren’t having anything like the problems NO is having, so you might not want to push this argument.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    More on this administration’s incompetence, from a February 16, 2004, New Orleans CityBusiness article (not online, unfortunately):

    The Corps’ [Army Corps of Engineers] New Orleans district in 2003 spent about $409 million on construction contracts, dredging and maintenance for the state’s waterways, real estate purchases, private sector design contracts and in-house expenditures, according to the Corps. That more than doubles the $200 million the district spent in 1991.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    Charlie: That’s what it would have taken. Of course, if he had done that, the same fucking idiots would have been complaining about an impending coup about 20 minutes later.

    As a matter of fact, I saw a thread on DemocraticUnderground where already several people are seriously theorizing that this whole disaster was planned in order to prime the nation for the martial law Bush will have to impose in order to get his third term.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    Clara, honey, I’m not sure what you mean by “air tankers”, but if you mean to carry water, well, no. But the big issue here is laws of physics: you can’t land an airplane where there’s no runway, you can’t drive trucks and buses over roads that have been destroyed or blocked by flooding, and even “heavy lift” helicopters like Chinooks are about the size of one bus. And the US is lots bigger than France. Europeans tend to forget that (and to be fair, when I lived in Germany, it was always a surprise to me how small Europe is.) A big part — 20 or 30 hours — of the 100 hours we keep talking about is because is just takes that long to cover the distance.

  • Charlie (Colorado)

    As a matter of fact, I saw a thread on DemocraticUnderground where already several people are seriously theorizing that this whole disaster was planned in order to prime the nation for the martial law Bush will have to impose in order to get his third term.

    And now add to that news coverage of Federalized National Guard troops moving poor black people out of their homes at gunpoint. For a mere storm.

  • http://www.buzzmachine.com Jeff Jarvis

    Folks: Have you ever noticed that when some of you start your rants, everyone else leaves and you just rant at each other… again?

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Here, let’s think about this for a moment: what could possibly have been done? Should Bush have declared an emergency, federalized the National Guard, overruled the Governor and the Mayor, declared martial law in New Orleans, commandeered all available buses, and forced the population in the low-lying parts of NO out at gun point?

    Again you should learn some Civics 101 before shooting your mouth off. The Mayor has *no* say in the deployment of the National Guard, and the President had all the authority he needed to go in as soon as a state of emergency was declared on August 27th, two days before Katrina made landfall. That’s all FEMA needed. And they blew it. FEMA’s very reason for existence is disasters such as these, so don’t start trying to peddle the “How could they have known?” and “These things take time” bullshit.

    The National Guard was called up by the Governor and ready for action by August 29th — that is, the less than 2/3′s left that hadn’t been sent overseas, along with critical equipment like high-water vehicles. Considering the entire NOPD department consists of 1500 officers, another thousand Guardsmen or two could have made the difference in stabilizing the situation. *That’s* where the President was needed. And that’s where he failed.

    You bet your ass I want my President to step up and protect my country when the circumstances warrant it. Two things should have been immediately apparent as Katrina approached: 1. the levees might fail, and 2. public lawlessness would almost certainly break out, as it does in any disaster’s wake. Having enough boots on the ground could have gotten more people out of the city and maintained an atmosphere of law and order.

    That’s not the Mayor’s fault; that’s not the Governor’s fault, either — both deployed what they had but it wasn’t even close to being enough, and everyone knew it… except for the Feds, who were too busy playing the guitar and shoe shopping to take things seriously until the likes of Sean Hannity were calling them out for it.

    Sorry, Charlie. Try LGF if you can’t handle the truth.

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Jeff: I thought this was all about the conversation!

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    JJ, since the early AMs *today*, there have been posts representing both “sides” including: LanceThruster, Angelos, Eileen, Gray, Faramin, Jersey Exile, Al Hill, Mommie Dearest, Charlie (Colorado), and myself. You just happened to come in right after Charlie (Colorado) and myself responded to the posters from a little earlier this morning.

    It’s a little silly to say that everybody else “left” even as a variety of people are still posting. But I do understand if you have some bandwidth worries or some other concern relating to busy threads.

  • http://flamingflivvers.blogspot.com/ Carson Fire

    Jersey Exile: Jeff: I thought this was all about the conversation!

    Well, whaddaya know… Jersey Exile and I are on the same page on *something*, anyway.

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Beyond the aesthetical disaster: Choices

    Here are some quotations I find out from your news papers:

    - “You cannot just blame the president, or any one person. Everyone is partly to blame. It’s the whole system.”

    - I said to a FEMA official, ‘What’s the main bit of advice you can give me?’ and he said, ‘You need to make sure you’re accounting for all your expenses,”

    And at least:

    - Pardon my French, everybody in America, but I am pissed…

    I am really trying to understand what’s going on in your part of the world, in my planet, and my stage questions are as follows:

    Don’t you think that part of your people, first of them some of your hegemonic leaders and what we call their fanatics fellowships red necks (only poor uneducated results of a decadent system of manipulation) plus some well thinking rich white people (only social soldiers of an ideological army), are afraid to see this ethno-ghetto get down by Katarina (those the whole system don’t need preferring let them kill each others or themselves instead of killing them directly) spread away and propagate their moral diseases to the rest of their cleany society?

    Thanks to all of you for helping me to understand how much your/our ideology is sick. How much your/our utopian managing system is out of control. How much your/our methodology of action is out too.

    I hope the rest of the world will figure it out to help humanity stop going on this way which pretends to pull us to progress. Which progress? Whose progress? Financial markets’ one? Ideology’s one? Well thinkings one? Rationalists’ one?

    Stop thinking, pretending and believing only this system can manage everything. We all must stop thinking mechanically, financially. We first must think humanly. That’s progress, human progress. Not an anonymous and blind progressing progress that even world economy’s barons recognize they don’t know anymore by whom and what it is driven.

    I think the entire world must end off with solidarity and think on fraternity. Referring to Oedipus’ and Antigone’s myths.
    I think we all must stop thinking technical performance, kind of 101’s know how, to first think human dignity.

    Don’t feel ashamed about your/our representatives. They are your/our representatives. By the less, those you/we have named; those whom our system has selected and recognized as right performers; those supposed to be able to generate money and a certain healthy. They are all managed by what they think is performance. They must do so because any else, the system will irrevocably erase them from power, money and recognition as it has already erased non purposed people. This system is now entirely controlling human lives and destinies, asserving us to its own benefits, not (any more) ours which remain humanists utopias. We must help them and help ourselves by laying down our day to day, individual, collective, local, global, cultural and historical experiences to think on a new paradigm. A paradigm dedicated to human’s and humanity’s benefits. Not anymore market’s or ideology’s ones.

    What to think about all of us if we still naming leaders who think prior on their media PR credibility or in other leaders’ recognition instead of people and individuals’ interests?
    What to think about all of us if we are only able to react to spectacular events? What to think about ourselves if we are only able to polemicate on responsibilities? What to think about us if we are active only in immediate basis? What to let think about us? That we are child? That’s what we became because of consumer and politic propaganda. It is time to wake up from hypnotise, to stop thinking selfishly or communitary which means for our similars. It is time to auto criticise our evolution management. It is time to summarise, to analyse and to act in regard of humans’ benefits. It is time to avoid market’s and ideology’s hegemony. Not only in the US. The point is that if we do not concert all together, no one will accept to be the first to take such a risk. And that’s the real power of this gigantic system: if we are not able to act in the same time all together, we will let him win.

    Do you know how the system will win? By achieving to confine us in child ignorance to let the system going on playing with our lives as short terms’ costs:

    “In L’enseignement de l’ignorance (the teaching of ignorance) Jean-Claude Michea informs us that in 1995, 500 politicians, economic and scientific leaders of foreground, component in their eyes the elite of the world, started to recognize as an obviousness which does not deserve to be discussed, that in the century to come, two tenth of the population will be enough to maintain the activity of the world economy. An essential question thus arises: how would it be possible to maintain the “governability” of 80 percent of supernumerary humanity, of which uselessness at summer programmed by liberal logic? The solution was found by Brzezinski, former adviser of J Carter under the name of “tittytainment”*: it is a question of defining a cocktail of hypnotizing entertainment and sufficient food making it possible to maintain the good mood of the frustrated population of planet.”
    Source: Herve Bokobza
    * Fusion between “entertainment” which means to divert and “tits” which means chest.

    Our very contemporary time is this of Dionysius, the very selfish forever child god of Antic mythology. Dionysius is a reminiscent of what was the Dévas (gods) in Indo European Sanskrit mythology; the parental one of all our monotheists’ religions and cultures, being Christians, Jews, Moslems, Buddhists, or whatsoever. Etymologically, Dévas became “dice” (in French “dés”, but also “déesses”, “idée/idea”, “video”, “destiny”, “disaster”, “to divert” and in Latin “ludus” which means play and entertainment) as mythological gods use to play human destiny with dice. What characterise the childhood is what we all are became today. People only able to get impressed and to act instinctively, aesthetically, first thinking on themselves, small selfish tirans. Disaster is what your country is experiencing today, what Asia has experienced a few months ago; a gods’ calamity. No one can be held responsible for this. But we all must be very careful not to get impressed by this tragic spectacle and only think what is immediate. Crisis comes from the Greek word “crisis” which means “choices”. Choices are the only way to answer to a crisis such as this.

    Don’t let time be the time of Dionysius only thinking selfishly, aesthetically in short terms. Don’t let La Boétie get right with his “Discours sur la servitude volontaire” (Speech about voluntary servitude). Don’t let our world head of which your empire became a second declining Roma which devise was “Bred and games for people”. Let this disaster time be the time of choices. Right choices which will make us all together grow to take in charge our lives, our human condition depending on these calamities. Stop naming responsible your ascendants or the system. The ultimate enemy of humanity as been revealed, its names are ultra human disaster and humanity heresy thinking we are gods!

  • Ravo

    Please read the link you yourself provided. It proves MY point….not yours.
    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/arng-dc.htm

    The mayor must request the needed assistance from the President,

    ONLY DC is unique in that it doesn’t require local jurisdiction to make the request.

    Please apologize

    Grray Says:

    September 3rd, 2005 at 6:55 am
    Rove, erh, sry, Ravo, ‘The Mayor should have had the National Guard ready to go’? For god’s sake, use your head first and search for information on topics you don’t know anything about before posting nonsense like this.

    I’m a german citizen and even I know that US mayors have NO authority over the National Guard, not even over the members who are inhabitants of the city. That’s ‘no’ in the meaning of zero, nil, nothing. Doing a quick google I found the information that not even the mayor of Washington DC has authority over ‘his’ National guard units:
    http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/arng-dc.htm
    Ravo, you’re either a totally ignorant blabbermouth or a spinmeister. But be beware that most here are not stupid enough to fall for your obvious misinformation.

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Beyond the aesthetical disaster: Choices

    Here are some quotations I find out from your news papers:

    - “You cannot just blame the president, or any one person. Everyone is partly to blame. It’s the whole system.”

    - I said to a FEMA official, ‘What’s the main bit of advice you can give me?’ and he said, ‘You need to make sure you’re accounting for all your expenses,”

    And at least:

    - Pardon my French, everybody in America, but I am pissed…

    I am really trying to understand what’s going on in your part of the world, in my planet, and my stage questions are as follows:

    Don’t you think that part of your people, first of them some of your hegemonic leaders and what we call their fanatics fellowships red necks (only poor uneducated results of a decadent system of manipulation) plus some well thinking rich white people (only social soldiers of an ideological army), are afraid to see this ethno-ghetto get down by Katarina (those the whole system don’t need preferring let them kill each others or themselves instead of killing them directly) spread away and propagate their moral diseases to the rest of their cleany society?

    Thanks to all of you for helping me to understand how much your/our ideology is sick. How much your/our utopian managing system is out of control. How much your/our methodology of action is out too.

    I hope the rest of the world will figure it out to help humanity stop going on this way which pretends to pull us to progress. Which progress? Whose progress? Financial markets’ one? Ideology’s one? Well thinkings one? Rationalists’ one?

    Stop thinking, pretending and believing only this system can manage everything. We all must stop thinking mechanically, financially. We first must think humanly. That’s progress, human progress. Not an anonymous and blind progressing progress that even world economy’s barons recognize they don’t know anymore by whom and what it is driven.

    I think the entire world must end off with solidarity and think on fraternity. Referring to Oedipus’ and Antigone’s myths.
    I think we all must stop thinking technical performance, kind of 101’s know how, to first think human dignity.

    Don’t feel ashamed about your/our representatives. They are your/our representatives. By the less, those you/we have named; those whom our system has selected and recognized as right performers; those supposed to be able to generate money and a certain healthy. They are all managed by what they think is performance. They must do so because any else, the system will irrevocably erase them from power, money and recognition as it has already erased non purposed people. This system is now entirely controlling human lives and destinies, asserving us to its own benefits, not (any more) ours which remain humanists utopias. We must help them and help ourselves by laying down our day to day, individual, collective, local, global, cultural and historical experiences to think on a new paradigm. A paradigm dedicated to human’s and humanity’s benefits. Not anymore market’s or ideology’s ones.

    What to think about all of us if we still naming leaders who think prior on short time (their time, the time of their very small responsibility), prior to their media PR credibility or in other leaders’ recognition instead of people and individuals’ interests?
    What to think about all of us if we are only able to react to spectacular events? What to think about ourselves if we are only able to polemicate on responsibilities? What to think about us if we are active only in immediate basis? What to let think about us? That we are child? That’s what we became because of consumer and politic propaganda. It is time to wake up from hypnotise, to stop thinking selfishly or communitary which means for our similars. It is time to auto criticise our evolution management. It is time to summarise, to analyse and to act in regard of humans’ benefits. It is time to avoid market’s and ideology’s hegemony. Not only in the US. The point is that if we do not concert all together, no one will accept to be the first to take such a risk. And that’s the real power of this gigantic system: if we are not able to act in the same time all together, we will let him win.

    Do you know how the system will win? By achieving to confine us in child ignorance to let the system going on playing with our lives as short terms’ costs:

    “In L’enseignement de l’ignorance (the teaching of ignorance) Jean-Claude Michea informs us that in 1995, 500 politicians, economic and scientific leaders of foreground, component in their eyes the elite of the world, started to recognize as an obviousness which does not deserve to be discussed, that in the century to come, two tenth of the population will be enough to maintain the activity of the world economy. An essential question thus arises: how would it be possible to maintain the “governability” of 80 percent of supernumerary humanity, of which uselessness at summer programmed by liberal logic? The solution was found by Brzezinski, former adviser of J Carter under the name of “tittytainment”*: it is a question of defining a cocktail of hypnotizing entertainment and sufficient food making it possible to maintain the good mood of the frustrated population of planet.”
    Source: Herve Bokobza
    * Fusion between “entertainment” which means to divert and “tits” which means chest.

    Our very contemporary time is this of Dionysius, the very selfish forever child god of Antic mythology. Dionysius is a reminiscent of what was the Dévas (gods) in Indo European Sanskrit mythology; the parental one of all our monotheists’ religions and cultures, being Christians, Jews, Moslems, Buddhists, or whatsoever. Etymologically, Dévas became “dice” (in French “dés”, but also “déesses”, “idée/idea”, “video”, “destiny”, “disaster”, “to divert” and in Latin “ludus” which means play, game and entertainment) as mythological gods use to play human destiny with dice. What characterise the childhood is what we all are became today. People only able to get impressed and to act instinctively, aesthetically, first thinking on themselves, small selfish tirans. Disaster is what your country is experiencing today, what Asia has experienced a few months ago; a gods’ calamity. No one can be held responsible for this. But we all must be very careful not to get impressed by this tragic spectacle and only think what is immediate. Crisis comes from the Greek word “crisis” which means “choices”. Choices are the only way to answer to a crisis such as this.

    Don’t let time be the time of Dionysius only thinking selfishly, aesthetically in short terms. Don’t let La Boétie get right with his “Discours sur la servitude volontaire” (Speech about voluntary servitude). Don’t let our world head of which your empire became a second declining Roma which devise was “Bred and games for people”. Let this disaster time be the time of choices. Right choices which will make us all together grow to take in charge our lives, our human condition depending on these calamities. Stop naming responsible your ascendants or the system. The ultimate enemy of humanity as been revealed, its names are ultra human disaster and humanity heresy thinking we are gods!

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Ravo,

    For the 50 states, “local jurisdiction” means the Governor, not the Mayor. As D.C. is not a state, if it were to have local jurisdiction, then that would fall to the District’s Mayor. But it doesn’t, so he must defer to the President, who is the commander-in-chief of the D.C. National Guard, even in the case of a local emergency.

    Anywhere else in the United States, Governors (not the Mayors) have the domestic control over the Guard.

    So our German friend is in fact correct.

  • John T

    Clara,

    You need to lay off the crack pipe.

  • AlanC

    JE :

    But it’s STILL NOT Bush. As I understand LA, the MAYOR had to request help from the Gov before she could ask Bush. This is all the legacy of the closest the US has ever come to a dictator Huey “KingFish” Long back in the ’30s who had a nasty tendency to usurp powers in LA that he didn’t have.

  • Ravo

    Exactly Alan…thanks.

    C’mon all you black racists trying to make this racial…lets see the same anger towards the Mayor for not contacting the Gov. to get the ball rolling, and for allowing all those people to be stranded like that in the first place…that you’d show a Mayor who had WHITE skin.

    You are all opportunists to divide people. DESPICABLES ALL

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Mortal calamity: immortalizing consequences

    It is necessary to live in intelligence with the system, but in revolt against its consequences, it is necessary to live with the idea that we survived worst. Jean Baudrillard

    The consequences of our actions are scarecrows for the cowards and the rays of light for the wise ones. Aldous Huxley

    If all the remainder fails, you will always be able to reach immortality by a spectacular error. John Kenneth Galbraith

  • Grray

    I’ve read several times now apologists declare that no request was made towards FEMA. I can’t help shouting now: STFU

    ‘President Bush has issued a pre-storm emergency declaration that puts federal agencies on alert to provide aid, Gov. Kathleen Blanco said Saturday night, adding that FEMA representatives told her such a move is highly unusual.’

    http://www.shreveporttimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050828/NEWS01/508280312/1002/NEWS

    THE PREZ HIMSELF ALERTED FEMA.
    I guess that should have been an authority high enough on the command chain to get them going.

  • http://oodja.blogspot.com Jersey Exile

    Grray,

    Exactly. FEMA was activated two days before Katrina hit.

    They have no excuse. They blew it. Case closed.

  • Carolyn Wright

    There is no need to point fingers at this point. Every part of the Administration underestimated this disaster and kept underestimating up for several days. They finally got the picture and started acting. Too bad it came too late for some folks down there. When I see people, I don’t see color or economical status, I saw people that were in pain, shock and total dispair. I never want to see that in America again!!! We need to turn Washington inside out if they are going to handle things this poorly. What chance would anyone have here against a huge terrorist attack? We need to all dig in and figure out what changes need to be made in Washington. God help us. What is morality? Thank You.

  • Linda Edwards

    “C’mon all you black racists trying to make this racial…lets see the same anger towards the Mayor for not contacting the Gov. to get the ball rolling, and for allowing all those people to be stranded like that in the first place…that you’d show a Mayor who had WHITE skin.”

    Ravo, this is about the 5th time I’ve seen you play the race card. You’re utterly disgusting!

    I’d like to see just how many of the Bushies are going to take Ravo to task. So far, I haven’t seen a single comment from them.

  • Clara from Paris, France

    Liam, Whodat: I would like to thank you officially here for helping me to improve my knowledge about the active influence of the US on European’s Wars of the past century.

    Now I am documented, I would like you both to explain me here who has financialy support Germany to go to 2WW? Who was the first provider of arms to Germany? Who didn’t respect his agreements with European countries during the 1WW, waiting 3 years before joining the combat for peace? Who had installed Hitler at the head of Germany? What for? Who reinforced Germany after the 2WW and why? Who wellcomed ex-nazies after the 2WW first of them the crazy scientists such as was Mengele? Who had achieved to ask huge amounts of money and economic asservisment for the price of a peace he had first provocated (as usual, that’s a trade mard)? Who had incouraged Japan in its tentative to asserve the rest of Asia? Why, knowing their methods? Who negotiated after the 2WW that Japan escape from the authority of international courts, knowing Japan was a nazy ally? Who had take the main benefits from Japanese medical experiences on human prisoners? Who still going on making war all over the word in the name of peace, pretending first they were fighting against communism, then against islmism? At least, who managed to keep its population under a so law level of instruction that you even cannot know the real history of your own country? I give you a track, it’s not the ex-Russia. Guess who it is… When you want to know about the cause of a war, surch for the vaincquor even hidden beyond the mask of pacificator. Those who had resisted to Hitler aigainst US capitalism and the European countries that were alreadey asserved to its power after 1WW is the same country who had so clearly analysed the US groth consequences at the very begining of the 20th century that they have so clearly describe what will happened, what still going on (the text I refer to is dated 1923). Before 2WW US threatened Europe by owning its whole economy, today China owns all our ones. So what are we going to do?

    What I learned thanks to you is realy very interesting. If you are not able to find the answers to my questions by yourselves I will be very glad to share my knowledge with you. But as far as English is not my mother tong and the texts are very long, it will ask me a real effort of translation and as froml now I am not sure that your quest for truth is motivated enough to allow you reading it, I prefer to wait for you to ask it for.

    Whatsoever, thank you again for your participation helping me to reinforce my historical knowledge. I keep going on.

    Please don’t think I blame americans. I blame the system and the ideology you fighted communism and today are fighting islamism with, I blame capitalism and a certain point of view on what must be the peace and the progress all over the world.

    Sorry having this kind of development here at this so dramatic time for some of your compatriots but you will understand that I am only answering to nationalists’ assertions.

  • Sarah

    Linda..I’m wondering that too. Everything Ravo posts has to do with race and/or others making things racial…..Yet all he does is play the race card (just from the other side of the fence).

    He’s clearly been taken to task several times about his lack of knowledge about the situation, even by people who aren’t even citizens of this country. If this wasn’t a time of despair, it would almost be funny.

  • Raymond Maçon

    More than a scandal, A crime

    The foot dragging by authorities is not the result of inefficiency.
    Nor is it latent racism.
    It is a cold calculated manoeuver designed to accomplish several goals of the Bush administration.

    1. A step toward martial law.
    The spin from the media, (which despite disinformation to the contrary is very much a part of Bush’s big-business coalition) is that the major problem in New Orleans has been the breakdown of law and order.
    That’s simply not true. The major problem has been the lack of vital needs such as food and water. The majority of the people who looted stores, did so to survive. Survivors of the situation has stated that 90% of the looting was only people looking for vital needs. In fact the “looters” were responsable for saving the lives of the elderly, the children, the infirm and all those who could not have survived without help.
    So why the over accentuation on “crime”?
    Because the Bush league plans to push through special emergency police powers to allow the president to send troops anywhere in the country whenever he chooses to do so, with or without the consent of state and/or local authorities.

    2. An increased state of paranoia.
    Just as in the case of 911, this catastrophe serves to terrorize the population. The public is being told a lie that whenever disaster strikes, people turn into savages. This has not been the case. In fact everything was done to make the situation as bad as possible. For instance radio broadcasts told people to go to the Superdome and the Convention Center, however there was absolutely no help to be found at those locations. When columns of troops did pass by those centers on Wednesday, they not only did not help in any way, they actually pointed their guns at anyone who approached the column.
    Meanwhile the media was blaming the disastrous situation in the centers on “mobs” and “gangs”. The ultimate aim is to make Americans afraid of poor people, especially blacks. But as I said earlier, it’s not really about race. It’s about fear. You have to have an enemy, a boogey man to scare the people. And since there aren’t enough Arabs in the area to blame them, blacks are the best choice.

    3 Distraction
    While everybody’s attention is diverted by the disaster, news about the rise of gas prices, escalating war casualties in Iraq, increasing resistance to the administration, the upcoming military draft, the approaching invasions of Iran and Syria, etc etc etc is pushed to the back pages.
    In this function, New Orleans has relplaced Aruba.

  • Randy

    Emergency preparedness is local first, state next and federal last. (We don’t really rely on the UN). The federal government provides assistance to the Governor, the governor assists the Mayor. States rights and state authority have been fought over fiercely from the founding of the country.

    The original failure in New Orleans is the creation since the “Great Society” of LBJ of abdication of inidividual responsibilities over to the Federal Government. New Orleans obviously had no emergency plan. Louisiana clearly had no plans, and then quickly called a press conference to blame the President of the United States. Did they really want him making their local plans for them? What’s thier job – if it isn’t to run their city and state?

    Now political hacks want to blame the President for the Hurricane and it’s aftermath. The conclusion being that because Liberals are so much more intelligent than Conservatives, that they would have been able to prevent the catastrophe had they been in power.

    I don’t know the political stripes of New Orlean’s Mayor or Louisiana’s Governor – but their abidication of responsibility to the Federal government hints that they are Democrats.

  • Mandi Bruns

    I am ashamed at this whole situation. On a whole our county is coming together. People all over the country are donating money and sending food and supplies. What about the government. Could you imagine thousands of people living in a super dome?? People weren’t being searched. Rapes were happening. Where were the police. Policemen and National Guards should have been in there protecting the American citizens. I am truly horrified and ashamed. There best is not good enough. What did they expect was going to happen. No wonder other countries don’t want to help us out.

  • http://www.sparesomechange.com Spare Change

    http://www.CrisisSearch.com has a search engine with thousands of disaster related websites and even a brand new crisis web blog for (online message forums) where we are seeking forum postings in aspects of disaster relief (housing, healthcare, rebuilding, evacuation routes, crisis planning, helpful charities, survival stories, missing persons/pets etc.). Please add helpful websites to the searchable crisis database or feel free to post your ideas for diaster prevention to recovery on our blogs.

  • http://www.mywise.net Daniel

    I couldn’t understand some parts of this article a scandal, but I guess I just need to check some more resources regarding this, because it sounds interesting.