Preaching terrorism

The Sunday Times of London had a reporter infiltrating a Muslim hate group three weeks before the 7/7 bombings. The paper’s summary:

An undercover investigation has caught leaders of a radical Islamic group inciting young British Muslims to become terrorists and praising the Tube bombers as “the fantastic four”.

A Sunday Times reporter spent two months as a recruit inside the Saviour Sect to reveal for the first time how the extremist group promotes hatred of “non-believers” and encourages its followers to commit acts of violence including suicide bombings.

The reporter witnessed one of the sect’s leading figures, Sheikh Omar Brooks, telling a young audience, including children, that it was the duty of Muslims to be terrorists and boasting, just days before the July 7 attacks, that he wanted to die as a suicide bomber.

After the attacks that claimed 52 lives, another key figure, Zachariah, justified them by saying that the victims were not “innocent” people because they did not abide by strict Islamic laws. In the immediate aftermath the sect’s leader, Omar Bakri Mohammed, said: “For the past 48 hours I’m very happy.” Two weeks later he referred to the bombers as the “fantastic four”….

The Saviour Sect was established 10 months ago when its predecessor group Al-Muhajiroun was disbanded after coming under close scrutiny by the authorities. Its members meet in secret in halls, followers’ homes and parks. They are so opposed to the British state that they see it as their duty to make no economic contribution to the nation. One member warned our undercover reporter against getting a job because it would be contributing to the kuffar (non-Muslim) system.

Instead, the young follower, Nasser, who receives £44 job seekers’ allowance a week, said it was permissible to “live off benefits”, just as the prophet Mohammed had lived off the state while attacking it at the same time. Even paying car insurance was seen as supporting the system. “All the (Saviour Sect) brothers drive without insurance,” he said.

Full story is here.

As they chatted the reporter was asked if he would be willing to wear a “strap” — slang for a suicide bomb belt. He laughed the suggestion off nervously and was relieved when everyone smiled….

Referring to the speed with which police issued closed-circuit television pictures of the suspects in the London attacks, Bakri suggested that they should have covered their faces to conceal their identity from prying CCTV cameras. This sparked a discussion with his right-hand man, Anjem Choudhury, which was taped by our reporter.

Choudhury: “It’s CCTV, sheikh; that’s the killer. You can’t go anywhere without them monitoring you now: down the street; out the station.” …

It’s a well-reported and frightening picture from inside a Muslim hate cult. Read the rest.

  • Mike G

    So now we know, the Times infiltrated a Muslim hate group… and a Muslim hate group infilitrated The Guardian.

  • Jim

    “Terrorist organizations use a number of sources to garner funds for their activities, such as petty crimes, kidnap-for-ransom, charities, sympathizers, front companies, and drug trafficking. Most of the known terrorist organizations use several of these methods to collect funding, while preferring particular methods to others. Drug trafficking is among the most profitable sources. According to the Office of National Drug Control Policy (ONDCP), Americans alone spend an estimated $64 billion on illegal drugs annually.”
    Source: Drug Intelligence Brief
    DRUGS AND TERRORISM: A NEW PERSPECTIVE Sept. 2002

    Besides infiltrating the nutcase religious groups, the investigative reporters should look into the connections between illegal drug activity and terrorism. Basically what I got out of the Times piece was that they found a bunch of idiots on welfare in London who could be prosecuted if a new law were passed to censor language. For now the socialist governments have an obligation to pay benefits to the people who want to kill them. What people say and what they do are two different things. I suggest that you could learn more from real street criminals that are actually breaking the law with what they are doing. New drug dealers are needed, just find out where you apply and where you buy. Of course the news gathering process is complex and hanging out with religious nuts is still safer than getting mixed up with drug dealers involved with narco-terrorism who are really breaking the law, not just chanting to allah about death to car insurance and death to the world.

    In America it works a little differently. Americans spend billions on destroying themselves and government spends billions cleaning up after them. I saw a story about Dan Rather, the self described watchdog, who is getting to the bottom of everything and nothing at the same time. I have a watchdog here, who is outside now. I know what he is doing. He doesn’t clean up after himself either. The entire debate about terror is based on this idea of this all being a religious movement. The truth is that these people promoting terror have very little in common with religion, except for they need a meeting place and it’s just a cover. For most of the news and media hacks, beating up on religion is much safer than beating up on international drug cartels funding terrorism and actually carrying out illegal activities, not sitting around talking trash. Rather and CBS spent resources on bogus stories for political gain while another ton of cocaine was being poured into the United States. Nobody saw that? They were busy looking at fake documents about W and playing watchdog while the narco-terrorists were making a killing on the streets of America. If terrorism is the new religion, they can blame God. It’s never the drug dealers fault or the idiots buying billions of dollars worth of coke. No, they couldn’t be a threat to national security could they?

  • paladin

    Well, gee, my comment seems a little tame after Jim’s rant, but the nut of it is the same. Why can’t our US reporters be as enterprising as their counterparts in the UK? When was the last time you saw something on 60 Minutes or any of their other clones, (or in a newspaper, for that matter) who did real investigative reporting, and not just give some schmuck a venue to advance his agenda(usually the reporter’s agenda as well)?

  • owl 1

    Surely not, paladin!

    I wonder if we would recognize it at this point. You mean some actual honest to God professional, investigative infiltration and reporting that might be tied to (shiver, shudder) protecting America……..instead of dressing it up in a Abu Ghraib?

    Nope. I have long since given up. Not a snowball chance in h……

    I say this as a former Democratic voter, who was “turned” when I just could not believe my lying eyes. Now I expect that ball to swing back, but it will never happen as long as 90% of MSM devote their resourses for political “hits”. Perfect example is the “outing” that is so horrible that her husband just had to appear in glorious color before every camera. A reasonable, sane middle America person might equate that to a lawyer saying to his friend, “You wear that red shirt in that farmer’s pasture. See if you can get that Bull’s attention. No? Well, wave this red cape because I have witnesses on the ready. AH-HAW! Let’s sue!!!!”

    Now I read leak after leak, day after day, one Deep Throat after the next Deep Throat. But it is never, ever anything useful. Never like the above reporting.

    Somebody screwed up. This seems a good thing for the Brits. NEVER IN AMERICA.

    I loved reading the details that might actually help the Brits. Good job.

  • Jim S

    Of course Jim doesn’t follow the news all that well since Blair has already proposed a complete revamp of Britain’s laws concerting these people and I doubt there will be a whole lot of trouble passing them. These people will be being booted out of England back to their countries of origin. Basically they will recognize that speech inciting violence is not acceptable and they’re planning on making it retroactive. Some of these “imams” who’ve let themselves be recorded preaching justification for violence will be deported when these laws take effect.

  • Jim S

    Paladin and owl 1 claim that they’d appreciate good investigative reporting…but mean that they’d like it as long as it ignores their conservative heroes. After all, when an investigation shows any Republican in a bad light it’s just a political hit.

  • Jim

    The news is just about worthless, so I don’t follow it too much. You are correct. It would be much easier to catch a murderer who stood in public and said I am going to kill whoever. I say let them continue to announce their intentions and amplify it a notch. The more they talk, the more they indict themselves and they do it in public. You can’t legislate speech and expect that it is going to stop communications or prevent violence. Why not just pass a law that prevents people from thinking certain thoughts? Then they can hire the thought police to monitor what people are thinking and arrest them if it violates the law.

  • Jim

    I just had a thought. I better check with my lawyer and see if it is legal before I go and write about it. I don’t want trouble with the thought police.
    There’s a war on, so it’s time to kill. The whole world is a potential battlefield. Today Iraq and next week, who knows? I doubt passing more laws will do anything to stop suicide bombing. How can you punish the suicide bomber, when they are dead? So these guys all get into session and write a law about something and read it, report it to committee and vote on it. It does nothing, but it helps pass the time. Then they talk with reporters and lobbyists and go home and sleep with their whore in Georgetown.

  • kat

    I fear for that poor reporter’s life. For sure the religion of peace guys will issue a fatwa.
    Maybe they could deport their families. I kind of like what Israel does–demolishes homes of gutblowers.
    Maybe Jim could tell us how to stop gutblowers–Clinton appeased and ass kissed and all it got him was more terrorism. I still think we should threaten to incinerate Mecca and Medina. I’m sick of pretending there are a majority of moderate muslims.

  • Eileen

    Jim,

    Would you prefer to be subject to a.) dhimmi thought police/head chopping enforcers if you don’t toe their sharia line, or, b.) treason and incitement laws which are enforced during time of war? A simple a. or b. answer would be great. Your statement, “I doubt passing more laws will do anything to stop suicide bombing. How can you punish the suicide bomber, when they are dead?” is beyond ludicrous.

    And yes we Can and Do legislate speech. The more You talk, the more You indite yourself, and You’re doing it in public.

    I rather see Britain And the U.S. just deport the bastards back to their hellholes of countries. If they prosecute and imprison, the garbage will just incite other inmates to become Islamofascist scum.

  • Jim

    Hi Kat, They are thinking are changing the name of the global war on terrorism. We don’t know what they are going to call it next. What to do Kat. I think all that can be done is what the U.S. Marine Corps do. Kill them all and let God sort them out. Send the Marines into London and let them clear the whole city out in 48 hours along with British forces. I guess the option is to have more political speeches and have the lawyers write more strict laws. It’s war. It’s time to kill. I believe that the kill ratio is supposed to be 10 to 1. That means the antiterror troops kill 10 of them for each person they kill. In World War Two, U.S. fighters shot down about 39 enemy planes for every U.S. plane shot down in the Pacific. The enemy would fly suicide missions and targeted U.S. hospital ships. To disable the enemy you have to kill them in large numbers and you can’t take prisoners. That was a big mistake early on. They should consider executing all the prisoners by hanging, which would stop this feeding and caring for the terrorists program which is crazy. You can’t build enough prisons to keep them all in. The only proven defense against Arab terrorism is a ruthless offense.

  • Jim

    “Censorship reflects a society’s lack of confidence in itself. It is a hallmark of an authoritarian regime . . . .” — Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart, dissenting Ginzberg v. United States, 383 U.S. 463 (1966)

  • kat

    I agree with the ruthless offense part–kill them before they strike. How does one put a stop to muslim terrorists?  The same way one puts a stop to a growing cancer… REMOVE IT.   Deport the bastards before they start demanding sharia as they are in Canada and other soft on terrorists countries.
    http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/article304303.ece
    {ntelligence chiefs are warning Tony Blair that Britain faces a full-blown Islamist insurgency, sustained by thousands of young Muslim men with military training now resident in this country.
    The grim possibility that the two London attacks were not simply a sporadic terror campaign is being discussed at the highest levels in Whitehall.}

  • Jim

    The political leadership has a big security detail and the public is fed speeches and excuses. I understand war and the people prosecuting this war need to get more aggressive. Bush is on vacation and Blairs wife is making more sense than he does. Put the women in charge for a week. These guys are both tired.

  • Eileen

    I did a one second google on Ginzberg, subject matter: pornography.

    Are you equating censorship of pornography with treason laws now?

    A simple a. or b. answer to my question would be great. The more you deflect, the more you indite yourself.

  • Jim

    Kat, It can’t be stopped totally. If it could, it would of been stopped already. It’s like any other criminal activity. Why is there murder? Terrorism is an idea and you can’t kill an idea. It’s not as if you can just make everybody forget about it. If I was responsible for the mass transit system in London, I’d shut it all down. Work from home with a modem, use a bike, walk or drive an automobile. All you can do is minimize the threats.

  • Eileen

    I guess my question is too difficult for you to answer, eh Jim? No surprise. You’d rather dhimmitize and have us all riding donkeys. Shut down mass transit? I would laugh but it’s too…ludicrous.

    And no, we have the ability to squash Islamofascism globally. Get it? You who ‘knows war’?

  • tonynoboloney

    I found it interesting that the imams encouraged their followers to be on the “dole”. This would be a good way for the U.S. to track and catch some of the extremeists as I’m sure they are doing this here too. Follow the money trail, begin to confiscate their bank accounts. Use the IRS ‘s power to audit all tax returns from Muslims suspected of any illegal activities, working off lists submitted by the FBI and CIA. Shut down Muslim civic organizations suspected of supporting terroists. Find volunteers to record worship services in every mosque in America, reporting any suspected terrorist sympathizers or those who would incite violence. Tell our children to report any subversive language/teaching that they may be exposed to on their college campuses. Run public service announcements declaring that Jihad is against the law and encourage everyday Americans to report all suspected activities in their communities, reward anyone who reports someone that ends in an arrest and conviction of the suspect. Enforce existing immigration laws for ALL illegal aliens and those with expired visas. Write to our senators and congressman demand that new laws pertaining to terrorism be written that would allow for deportation for hate speech or anyone suspected of inciting violence. Although many of these suggestions may put us on a slippery slope as to personal freedoms, we are at war, and most Americans would not be effected, we know who the enemy are we know where he is from and we know what he looks like. Drastic circumstances demand drastic action.
    I find it laughable that we should rely on American MSM to do investigative reporting so as to expose the perpatrators of terrorism. The left media has already spoken clearly and can no longer be believed nor relied upon for this all to important task.

  • Eileen

    And Jim, let’s just get down to brass tacks, eh? Let’s assume for even a bare moment that there was an all out ‘effort’ by Islam to call their dogs (i.e., ‘moderate Muslims’) and attempt an all out jihad for the caliphate. They constitute one fifth of the globe’s population. But who constitutes the other FOUR fifths? That’s right, NON-MUSLIMS.

    I’ve got news for you, bud. The other 4/5 of the global population BILLIONS of us are NOT going to lay down for sharia thugs. If necessary, we will wipe the scourge from the face of the earth, from every corner, every hole, every cave, and from every dark, dingy quarter. The maniacs will NOT prevail.

    If the idiot imams are supported by Muslims at large and IF they do their bidding, I’m quite sure they Will get the great global war they so desperately, foaming-at-the-mouth foment.

    The jews will NOT be wiped from the face of the earth, and the infidels will NOT be slaughtered or dhimmitized. We 4/5′s of the globe simply won’t allow it.

    You don’t need to answer my question. There is no contest between civilized law and sharia barbarism.

  • Jim

    The world would be more secure if the billions of us could locate the where abouts of one bin-laden. Of course if we did, he would have the best lawyers in the world formulating a legal defense. It’s a perverse world. I censor the things I want censored, which means I don’t have any use for others who would do it for me. Thanks for the challenge.

  • Eileen

    Yes, Tonynobaloney (as Usual!) and particularly this: “The left media has already spoken clearly and can no longer be believed nor relied upon for this all to important task.”

    For example, wonder why MSM doesn’t investigate the cozy financial ties and history between CNN and Al Jazeera?!!! [Please DO Google all about it.] Oh, that’s right, because the rest of MSM are also acting ‘apologists’.

    Follow the money.

    Whether it’s Imams or apologists, I suggest we need to root All of them out.

  • Eileen

    Thanks for NEVER answering that simple question, ‘Jimbo’.

  • Jim

    I just got this in.
    With laptops and DVDs, in secret hideouts and at neighborhood Internet cafes, young code-writing jihadists have sought to replicate the training, communication, planning and preaching facilities they lost in Afghanistan with countless new locations on the Internet.

    Now they are writing code and creating a web of terror at the neighborhood Internet cafes. This will be the next thing, the blogs of terror. Another reason not to link to unknown sources for all you link maniacs out there.

  • Eileen

    A good night billet doux to Jimbo: So. If we billions haven’t caught OBL – who could be dust in a bat cave, with donkeys for mass transit – we’re ‘losing the WOT’?

    I don’t think so, little man.

    Great failed attempt at demoralization.

    Side thought. Having travelled to the ME, I always thought it was diabolical that the burkas women are REQUIRED to wear from head to toe are ALWAYS BLACK, in 115 degree heat!!!!, while the men – the oh-so-superior of all superior ones who are – of COURSE! – ALSO gifted with beating their women by sharia law and cutting off their clitorises so they never know any joy, wear white, flowing robes…

    It is too sick to even contemplate.

    Sharia or civilized law, eh Jimbo?

  • owl 1

    The only thing I see these people have in common with criminals, is their killings. They are more like cults that have sprung up. Only now I do not believe they just “happened”. I think it goes all the way back to Iran taking the hostages under Carter.

    That was a nasty side of Islam that fought to be back in control. Well they made it and infiltrated their nasty little racist views all over the world.

    It seems to be all about Dominence. Give them some whips, black gloves and handcuffs and it would look the same.

    The KKK had nothing on this cult of racists but you notice that some blacks do not notice. They actually trade in slaves in some of the countries.

    Women must cover up from head to toe because they evidently can’t control their urges. Or they can’t control their jealous urges. Or they just consider women as lower than 2nd class citizens. Which is it?

    Women should not vote.

    Women should not drive.

    Women should never have equal rights.

    Women should just be hidden.

    I think they have a very big problem with women. We consider a lot of the behavior to be perverts.

    Now they might want to call it a religion. I feel sure there are millions who are peaceful and do practice a version of Islam. I could care less how they practice their religion, unless they decide to become mass killers. Or decide women can’t dress themselves. Or that women can’t vote. Or that women can’t drive. Then I care and I will be into “thought police” myself.

    The president is right and I now fully understand why he keeps saying that they “hate democracy”. Read the above article and you will see it is all about hating democracy. They are into slaves and whips and they hide it under the label religion.

  • Jim

    This died at 1:19 today. Maybe somebody will try CPR.

  • kat

    Muslim terrorism has not died–we need to obliterate it–even if it means obliterating millions of the hate cultists. We can not tolerate these scummy bastards. Democracy can only offer freedom as long as it is not used
    against others with equal rights.
    A society should give us all freedom but at the same time
    protect us from others who abuse it.
    Most democracies are extremely reluctant to “address” in a
    political or legal sense, religious groups, political parties or
    ethnic groups from within their society, simply because their
    freedom is guaranteed by its very constitution.
    As soon as these groups’ behaviour becomes politically
    destabilising or a clear and proven danger to others (like,
    say, a muslim terrorist threat)….then that may need to change. IT IS TIME FOR CHANGE!!

  • Jim

    Kat, To kill millions of people you need gas chambers and furnaces to burn the bodies. Maybe Bush and his buddies in the energy industry can work this out. I wonder how many BTU’s you get from a burning body. They can develop new energy plants with slave labor and then just burn the workers when the thing gets finished and is running. I’d look up German history Kat to see how to run the paperwork. Maybe Halliburton has some ideas about this. If there’s a billion dollar no bid deal, they’ll do about anything for a buck.

  • Jim

    I think they’ll just go the slow killing route. This way the war profiteers and other pirates can milk the Pentagon cow for years. They could build death camps, but I doubt it. This war is being run like a business.

  • Jim

    This may be the most profitable war in history. I’m not sure it’s really a war, it’s more like a Murder Inc. racket run by politicians rather than mobsters. We need new laws to give them the tools they need. The debt being created could be a problem. We are going to get free oil.

  • Jim

    Bush knows what he is doing. Congress and the Senate is a big joke. They are laughing all the way to the bank though. I don’t like to see U.S. troops being killed. The people who are doing the strategic planning screwed the military. Bush is goofing off on vacation this week.

  • kat

    muslims are killing millions in Sudan and Nigeria and without gas furnaces–just a bullet will do these guys. Islamofascism is yesterday’s naziism. You likely would have been against killing Nazis too.

  • owl 1

    You right Kat. I keep wondering if Jim even bothered to read the article. He has a strange response to it.

    Jim seems to think these people “hatched” in 2000. Wonder how he connects the Embassies, first WTC and the Cole?

    It’s not about Bush, Jim. Get over it and look at Sharia in Canada. Sitting on our doorstep. Dominence with women rights stripped.

    I find the absolute silence of the women’s groups deafening. Ditto with all the international human rights organizations. They seem very concerned with 500 at Gitmo but I never hear them raving and op-eding over what has happened to women’s rights, in front of their very noses.

    Where are they?

  • Jim

    It’s all too much. The global culture is a culture of death. The effort to make the world save and filled with peace and goodwill failed. The entire leftist agenda seems bunk. Just keep asking questions though. Chances are you’ll get more questions and few answers. New laws are the answer and then there are questions about the new laws. A drunkard wants another drink of wine and the politician wants the vote. A rich girl wants to marry and a poor girl wants to flirt. A rich man goes to college and a poor man goes to work. I’m not asking you for nothing at all. Enough with the 50 questions routine already. Please. Go ask Jeeves. It has answers.

  • Jim

    Preaching blogism……
    A buzzmachine exclusive.
    Welcome to the wild goose chase.
    Where is the goose?

  • kat

    moderate islam is the goose.

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